Friday, 2015-01-02

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OksanaWhen trying to flash N950 with latest Nemo Mobile, I get black screen after green letters. As if lipstick was not able to launch?..
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coderusit using statefs library, not acting directly with dbus01:50
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Steven__Is anyone working on a Nemo image/install for the N900? I just got one for Christmas and I have been trying to work out what to install on it.04:40
OksanaNay, I heard of vakkov working on Nemo-for-N900, but not sure about current status.04:42
OksanaWhat are the shortcomings and-or missing-features of Maemo 5 on N900?04:43
Steven__Okay. I would be willing to do some testing if that is what he needs.04:44
Steven__Well, the software is a lot older as I understand, seeing as how it only gets updates through CSSU now, which feel a bit sparse.04:46
OksanaOkay, ask him about Nemo-for-N900. He will wake up in a few hours, if I understand his local time correctly.04:47
Steven__The default install seems pretty nice sofar though, but I suspect I will run into trouble with doing non-typical-nokia-user stuff.04:47
OksanaI am using CSSU-Testing every day on my N900, and beta-testing Nemo Mobile on N950.04:47
Steven__I see. Do you duel-boot anything?04:48
Steven__I installed the stable CSSU. Do you recommend testing? I don't have any critical things that I need this phone for and I have some Linux CLI experience in case trouble comes up.04:49
OksanaCSSU-Testing is updated more frequently. And gets new features, too. I do not use dual-boot, so far; SD cards have only ever given me trouble.
Steven__Do you use Thumb?04:56
OksanaNay, not meddling with kernel.04:56
OksanaIf you have any questions, ask. There are plenty of awesome applications on Maemo 5. I am a relatively cautious person: no over-clocking, no swappolube, et cetera.04:57
Steven__Yeah. Atleast you can reflash so long as the bootloaders are okay.04:57
Steven__Cool, thanks. =)04:57
OksanaNo problem :-)04:58
Steven__If I had TWO N900s I would probably do that. But this is actually my only phone now.04:58
OksanaOh, and we careful with micro USB port.04:58
Oksanabe* careful04:58
Steven__And it is my first smartphone. Before I just said "too proprietary" and left them alone.04:58
Steven__Yes, thanks. I have already filed off the hooks on the charger connector, and I plan to solder the port at some point.04:59
OksanaFile teeth of the cable, or something. Because it's extremely common for N900 users to have the port breaking off the board.04:59
Steven__Any other recommended HW mods?05:00
Oksana((filed off the hooks)) Great :-) It's my first mobile phone, and it's still with me. There was a brief interaction with N950, though.05:00
Steven__I have been thinking about the backplate for the double batteries, but it is expensive for a piece of plastic.05:00
OksanaHmm... Get a dust-proof thingie for headphone jack.05:00
Steven__What do you think of the N950? It sounds like an updated-hw version of the N900 to me, but I thought it would be too hard to get one since it was only a limited release.05:01
Steven__Oh, good idea.05:01
Steven__Let me make a note of that.05:01
OksanaN950 is hard to get, and difficult to repair if it breaks. Parts for N900 are easier to find. And, N950 does not have slot for memory card.05:03
Steven__Damn. The first ones are bad enough, but the last one would hurt.05:04
OksanaMy headphone jack is green from so-called water damage (I haven't ever had a water-liquid-incident with my phone), that's why I am sure that dust-cover is a useful thing.05:04
Steven__You mentioned having trouble with the SD cards, but I am a bit leery of installing another OS on anything integrated into the phone.05:05
OksanaMy N950's SIM slot was broken, after being mistaken for memory card slot. Going to repair it, though.05:05
OksanaYes, that's why I keep using Maemo 5 on N900. And, I like the GUI.05:05
Steven__Hmm. You might be able to clean that by a careful application of distilled vinegar followed by distilled water.05:06
OksanaMy only trouble with SD cards was from having them non-ejected from computer. Especially Windows computer, I think.05:06
Steven__Oh, well, I haven't run Windows (or any proprietary OS) for some years now.05:07
OksanaMaybe, I will just replace the headjack. What's the point in cleaning up copper surface if I cannot return gold plating onto it?05:07
Steven__2009 I think.05:07
OksanaThe jack is not soldered to anywhere, between. So, it should be easy to replace it.05:07
Steven__Oh, yes that would be better if you had a spare. I was thinking it was soldered to the board, but now I recall that it had contacts.05:08
Steven__Copper does not need a gold plating to make a good contact. It would just provide corrosion resistance.05:08
OksanaYes, to make it easier to take the board out of the case, or put it back in.05:08
Steven__You might clean the green one just to have a spare.05:08
OksanaExactly, corrosion resistance is something the jack is lacking at this moment.05:09
Steven__You might be able to replate copper with a solution of gold tetrachloride.05:09
Steven__But it would probably be easier to buy one. =P05:10
OksanaMaybe. It's not urgent, since I don't use headphones, most of the time. But later, after repairing microUSB port, I will probably replace the jack, and get a dust cover for the new one.05:10
Steven__Have you ever used the video-out?05:11
Steven__I am wondering how it looks on a larger screen.05:11
Steven__But I didn't get a cable for it with my phone.05:11
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Steven__Hmm. It occurs to me that where the jack resides would be a perfect place to put a very small circuit without doing case modifications.05:19
Steven__Seen any mods to gain access to the busses put on the test points for diagnostics?05:21
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OksanaYes, I have used video out. When the main flex ribbon was torn, and I wanted to make sure that everything else work, and that's only ribbon needing replacement.05:22
Steven__I2C would be great for sensors, but the test points are difficult to get to...05:22
* Oksana off-topic: Neo900 is going to have hacker-bus, including I2C, if I understand correctly.05:23
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Steven__Yes. I have seen this. UART looks easy to get to, but I am less familiar with it.05:25
Steven__So you use Maemo/Nemo, any others? I have been considering trying Debian, since I use it on one of my laptops, but it would probably end up being for non-communication use.05:29
Steven__I mainly want to use it as a phone, but with real security instead of proprietary "security", e.g. FLOSS with LUKS/Tor/GPG/etc.05:32
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locusfmorning :)06:18
Steven__Ack. It's morning already?06:22
locusfit is here at least06:27
locusf8:27 am06:27
locusfvakkovs nemo effort is currently based on (latest observation) getting android running on n900 and then using that as libhybris bootstrap to boot nemo :)06:30
locusfso its quite intricate06:31
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filippzmorning people06:36
filippzcoderus: ty for reply - I figured that statefs doesn't work with dbus, but battery-bme module from mce listens to dbus for battery info06:39
filippzI was wondering who is supposed to supply that info on dbus....06:40
Steven__locusf: That method of bootstrapping sounds very fragile. Do you know why all that is needed? I was thinking more along the lines of U-Boot -> GRUB SD-card -> kernel SD-card06:53
locusfSteven__: well its the only way to get wayland up and running since the latest gpu version of the n900 is too old to run it, Androids hwcomposer implementation is newer and probably allows wayland to function correctly06:54
Steven__Hmm, wait I think I can nix GRUB, unless it is required for dm-crypt/LUKS.06:54
Steven__Oh. I guess there isn't much hope of a native driver then. I think the one usually used is proprietary, right?06:56
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locusfyeah I guess so06:56
Steven__Actually claims that support was added in the 3.3 kernel.06:59
Steven__You may have to forgo OpenGL ES though, since that is closed up.06:59
locusfare you looking at PowerVR SGX530 row?07:00
Steven__OMAP DRM07:00
Steven__Oh, and that.07:00
Steven__OpenGL ES is just acceleration, not output. Though it might be crummy without it.07:01
locusfI wonder how KMS would work07:01
Steven__Is it necessary?07:02
locusfI don't personally know07:03
Steven__I thought that was just if you needed to change the settings after booting.07:03
Steven__It's not like your going to be swapping monitors on a phone.07:03
locusfwell thats true :)07:04
Steven__(I guess you could, but I would be very interested in why you would set it up that way!)07:04
locusfheheh I know Esa, good guy07:08
Steven__Looks like something called EGLImage is needed. Part of OpenGL ES, I guess?07:08
Steven__Looks like Esa didn't persue it though, from how the thread went.07:10
Steven__So I'm guessing the Android boot method provides OpenGL ES with EGLImage.07:11
Steven__I thought the underlying system would be almost the same between Android and vanilla Linux. Couldn't the driver just be moved over?07:11
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Steven__Doh. If I had looked up libhybris before asking that question, I wouldn't have needed to ask it.07:15
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Steven__So Google took libc from BSD so they wouldn't have to deal with the GPL and then extended it in ways not compatible with glibc. Now the drivers from Android can't be directly ported to GNU.07:18
Steven__And here I had hopes of getting rid of X once and for all.07:19
Steven__Taking pleasure in my misfortune? Lol. Ever tried to get Xorg to do something that it isn't typically set up to do? It's a nightmare!07:33
locusfwell not yet :)07:34
Steven__I once tried to have per-application GUI isolation by spawning a Xephyr (nested X server) server for every application launched and then nesting them Xorg.07:35
Steven__After I pulled all of my hair out over that I wrote off X security completely. This was before Wayland development was announced.07:37
Stskeepswayland is so much saner07:38
Steven__Finally! Finally, we have a display server that doesn't let every application grab the display of every other application and the mouse and keyboard stream AND paste anything it wants to in any other GUI's window.07:38
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spiiroinfilippz: the mce battery-bme is using the oldest legacy battery interface that I recall existing;  IIRC originally it was provided by bme-dbus-proxy or something like that; in n900 hald-addon-bme provided standard hal battery properties + old style dbus signals that only mce used; I do not remember exactly how it went in N9 (I was not doing battery stuff anymore at that time) but probably something similar09:07
spiiroinfilippz: i.e. since hald is no longer used, the missing piece might be hald-addon-bme -like functionality09:08
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filippzspiiroin: would rewriting battery-mce module to use statefs possible, and better approach than adding dbus stuff to statefs statefs-providers-bme?10:03
spiiroinfilippz: that is the long term plan10:04
spiiroinfilippz: it was actually done ages ago, but there were kernel+fuse related technical problems -> has been pending for ages10:05
filippzspiiroin: so the battery-mce has already been converted to use statefs? Where is that located?10:09
spiiroinfilippz: old wip that did not work is here:
spiirointhen there is one deztructor fixed some time ago10:11
spiiroinbut that still needs to be verified, and IIRC statefs start/restart detection is missing10:14
filippzthis is not bme specific?10:15
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coderusfilippz: statefs have some module to make contextfs properties over dbus11:02
kjokinielbt: phaeron: I made this small script tool for checking event device capabilities:, any suggestions where to put the git and rpm to? was thinking of mer-tools11:06
lbtkjokinie: is it for run-time or during image build ?11:07
kjokinielbt: for run-time11:07
kjokinielbt: main use case is to run that in udev rule to check if a given event device is supporting bits that are needed11:07
kjokinielbt: and my use case is to find the touchscreen11:08
lbtmer-tools is not meant to be enabled on most user devices11:08
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lbtif you want to use it to generate a rule and then put the rule in another package - mer-tools is good11:08
Stskeepssmells like mer/nemo material11:09
lbtif it's supposed to support dynamic (usb) event devices then maybe core?11:09
Stskeepsor mer-hybris11:09
lbtyeah - hybris for HA level normally but this needs to be run on-device11:09
kjokiniethat hybris was the other place I was thinking11:09
lbtwe have/had a hybris-common build area11:10
Stskeepsis a kind of HA thing11:10
kjokinielbt:  so hybris-common then?11:11
lbtsounds reasonable :
lbtthe latter for now I think11:13
kjokinielbt: ok, thanks. any specific place for the git repos on those, or do I just keep it in my gitlab home tree?11:14
Stskeepsthis thing will need to be used in udev rules in a ha adaptation, fwiw, so maybe we should just put it in mer11:15
Stskeepsto give a unique touchscreen udev symlink, right11:15
lbtthere are similar tools in the hybris/HA area11:16
lbtand they have repos used to build images11:16
lbtif it's HA then hybris seems sane (ie it's not core)11:16
lbthybris is also currently more actively updated11:17
kjokinielbt: Stskeeps: I would use it in a hybris adaptation, so as long as the repo is there, I'm happy11:17
lbtI think we may move other things from hybris to core eventually (libsepol etc)11:17
kjokinielbt: could you create "evcap" repo to
filippzcoderus: then adding dbus_types.hpp and xml file like profiled and other statefs providers have would be "the right way" at this time?11:21
kjokinielbt: thanks11:22
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coderusfilippz: i dont understand11:44
filippzcoderus: I'm seeing some xml files in difereent statefs-providers that describe dbus interfaces. Are those for reading values to statefs or emmiting values from statefs?11:47
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locusfcoderus: if you start your Finland tour only at next week I might not be able too meet with you :/, unless its tuesday11:54
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coderuslocusf: i'm in finland until 8th Dec i think12:01
coderusalready in finland 30 Dec :)12:02
coderus*until 8th Jan i mean :D12:02
locusfcoderus: yeah saw your twitter when you arrived :)12:02
coderuslocusf: so, where are you from?12:02
locusfcoderus: I currently live in Kuopio12:02
coderusand next days?12:03
locusfstill same place of course12:03
locusfits just that I gotta go to work at monday, wednesday and thursday12:03
locusfwhen were you planning on getting to Kuopio?12:04
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locusfoh yeah you were going to the cafe, lets discuss in the evening :)12:05
gogetahi guys12:12
gogetalocusf, newz from n9 front12:17
gogetafrom the wrist front ... some libhybris madness are occuriing12:18
gogetai can't link against android libui12:18
locusfgogeta: no news I guess12:18
gogetaon ascend you got bionic original source code ?12:18
locusfgogeta: I don't know12:21
gogetathe huawei with their custom Soc12:21
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faenilhola o/12:23
Stskeepsmoo faenil12:24
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gogetahi faenil12:24
gogetaStskeeps, good morning12:25
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m4g0gquestions about transfer-engine are allowed here?14:05
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faenilm4g0g: why not :)14:54
faenilyou can always try, not sure who's the maintainer though14:55
m4g0gI have created my plugin for this. But I can't get sharing url from qml to c++ plugin. How I can do it?14:57
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locusffaenil: was it by design that the drawer gets activated when tapping on the title of an application?15:35
faenilby design iirc15:35
faenilI didn't do anything myself, iirc, I just followed specifications :D (or asked on IRC when needed)15:36
faenilis it inconvenient?15:36
locusfno, I was just wondering, I have 3 toolbar icons which to press, if I press just right or on the titlebar the drawer activates15:37
faenilyeah well that's a different issue, we should fix that somehow :) bigger mouse areas or something15:38
locusfhmm its rather that the mousearea is larger than the menu button :)15:38
locusfit makes the drawer easily accessible though15:39
faenilif you accidentally tap on the header instead of the button, it means the button mousearea isn't big enough, right? :D15:39
locusfon maguro its a pain to activate corner areas of the touchscreen15:39
locusfhmm well I guess so then :p15:39
faenilwhat do you mean by "larger than the menu button"? which area15:40
locusfin the header15:40
Steven__Goodmorning all.15:40
locusfI have 3 toolbuttons + the drawer activating button on the far right15:40
faenilSteven__: o/15:40
faenillocusf: ah right, that one as well!15:40
locusfbut the drawer is also activated when tapping just left of the toolbuttons right to the edge of the screen15:41
locusfleft edge15:41
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