Wednesday, 2013-02-27

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yunta_RzR: afaik VMs we ship are 32bit regardless of bit-ness of installer and qt-creator. So, if you're altering vm's by hardcore-file-copying, you have to mix and match carefully :)00:34
yunta_s/vm's/VMs/00:38
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tiduxso, question about the guts of Sailfish02:41
tiduxwill it have proper CUPS support available, or AirPrint?02:41
tiduxbecause printing in Android is a complete clusterfuck02:42
tiduxsaying "print as easily as an iPhone" would be a big win02:42
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covoxyou can print easily on an iphone?03:10
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tiduxfrom what I heard03:15
tiduxwith AirPrint anyway03:15
tiduxseems easy to set up03:15
tiduxcombine that with Linux style access to the filesystem and you'd be golden03:15
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covoxisn't there zero expectation of printing support within an iOS app03:18
covoxapple probably grafted it onto pages and numbers, for obvious reasons, but I doubt most iOS users know it exists03:20
tiduxyeah, but still it proves you can use IPP and mDNS to do network printing without 30GB of drivers03:25
covoxthat may be, but where's the demand from mobile users to print stuff03:30
tiduxwell I'd want it03:30
tiduxmaybe I'll just make an app for it03:30
covoxwhat would you even print03:31
tiduxPDFs03:32
tidux1. use mobile device to SSH to big server somewhere03:32
tidux2. write in LaTeX or groff03:32
tidux3. compile to PDF03:32
tidux4. scp/sftp to mobile device03:33
tidux5. print03:33
tiduxI've done this a few times03:33
covoxmake an app for it :P03:39
tiduxrighty-o03:40
tiduxadmittedly it would be more useful on tablets03:41
tiduxwhere you can hook up a keyboard and write with vim03:41
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MFaroTusinoI can't get the sdk running :/09:10
niweberMFaroTusino: what is the problem?09:11
MFaroTusinoI am using a ubuntu vm so i think its that09:11
MFaroTusinoI chmod +x then ./Sailfish...09:11
MFaroTusinoand it just displays no file/folder found09:11
MFaroTusinoeven though i have cd to the directory of the .run file09:12
niweberok, that is a bit weird09:12
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StskeepsMFaroTusino: are you on 32 or 64 it09:12
Stskeepsbit09:12
MFaroTusinoi am running as root09:12
MFaroTusinoi am on 64 i think, but got the 32 just to be sure09:12
MFaroTusinowould that be why?09:13
niweberI would recommend installing as the user you want to develop with into that users homedir09:13
niweberIt could be that you are missing some compatibility libraries09:13
niweberinstalling 64 bit could fix your problem09:13
JonniMFaroTusino: sdk should not be installed as root09:13
StskeepsMFaroTusino: es, get the 64 bit one then09:13
Stskeepsand what jonni said09:14
niweber(it is mainly the installer itself and QtCreator that are 64 bit in that package, rest is the same as 32 bit)09:14
MFaroTusinookay didn't even think about that as being the reason, will try 64-bit now09:15
MFaroTusinothanks for the support guys, will let you know how it goes09:15
niweberwelcome and please report back :)09:15
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MFaroTusinoit worked, thanks guys :)09:31
MFaroTusinooff to get coding :)09:32
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niweber:)09:32
meegoexpertsGood luck !09:33
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abique|workHi, which devices are supported?10:01
Stskeepsright now? only sailfish emulator10:01
abique|workok, and do you think that I'll be able to flash my samsung gs3 with it in a year?10:03
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Stskeepshardware adaptation is hard, always assume that you won't be able to10:04
abique|workok10:05
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thpin the emulator, the sailfishsilica package metadata says "License: TBD", qml files in /usr/lib/qt4/imports/Sailfish/Silica/ have a BSD license header - there's no open source git repo for silica yet, right?10:43
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Stskeepscorrect, it was said on fosdem that it will be open source and that has to be done properly, ie, open development, and a sdk launch is not a good place to do that10:44
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Stskeepsthe primary use of the QML parts is that you specialize the components by copy-pasting them10:46
Stskeepsfor an app developer10:46
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khertanMorning11:09
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Stskeepsmorn khertan11:18
khertanStskeeps, with jolla and sailfish sdk release your mer project got a nice media cover11:19
khertan:)11:19
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khertancongratz11:19
Stskeepskhertan: thanks, hope you enjoy the sdk too11:19
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khertanStskeeps, i got a good experience with it, run like a charm, install in few minutes, run in few seconds, launch example in 2s ... oh take a look at the docs ... click click i read ... :)11:21
Stskeepshehe11:21
khertan(didn't got the same experience on the second pc ... : you need to install virtualbox : virtualbox-dkms build failed ... patch ... retry11:22
sledgescould you please add this to topic: https://sailfishos.org/wiki/SDK_Alpha_Known_Issues ?11:23
khertaninvoke gcc ... do voodoo magic ... come back to a released kernel instead of devel ... and oh it s works ... that my fault11:23
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khertansledges, thx but that was a problem with compiling an old vbox kernel module from debian stable on a 3.8 kernel which was a devel version not even an rc :) (yeah it s my test machine)11:25
khertan:)11:25
* khertan should finish BitPurse 1.5 for harmattan before trying to port it to jolla11:26
ali1234bitcoins?11:26
khertanali1234, yep11:26
ali1234cool11:26
khertanit s already works on sailfishos with harmattan component ..... but hum ... that s not integretad to the os11:27
khertanali1234, https://khertan.net/static/medias/sailfish_more_apps.png11:28
khertanali1234, http://www.khertan.net/pages/bitpurse.html << 0.9 version didn't manage wallet and so depends on blockchain.info MyWallet, 1.5 didn't depends on it anymore11:29
khertanali1234, it s a light client like electrum11:30
aportalekhertan: 1337! :)11:30
khertan:)11:30
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khertanbe a geek or not :)11:30
ali1234really cool... are you going to support the new 0.8 stuff for light clients?11:31
khertanhum ... oh my client didn't support yet all feature of 0.7.x :)11:32
khertanlike signing message ...11:32
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khertanwhat's new in 0.8 ? i think it was only db changes ...11:32
khertanand some other optimization11:32
ali1234thre is a a new protocol for light clients to get information from full nodes11:33
khertanoh ...11:33
khertaninteresting11:33
Stskeepsindeed11:33
* Stskeeps marks in notebook11:33
ali1234"Bloom filter" support in the network protocol for sending only relevant transactions to lightweight clients.11:34
ali1234that's all i know (from changelog) you'll have to google the rest :)11:34
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khertanali1234, i'm lucky : https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/BIP_003711:35
Stskeepsbeer for the first person who adds bitcoin as payment method to sailfishos ;)11:35
khertanStskeeps, hum... BitPurse already works on sailfishvm i send a transaction with it yesterday11:36
khertan:)11:36
khertans/send/sent11:36
khertanbut i need to port it to use silica components11:37
khertanali1234, bloom filter is an extension to p2p protocol ... so cann't really used on a phone where all phone isp lock p2p networks11:38
ali1234hmm... that's only really half true11:38
khertanali1234, ?11:39
ali1234i mean, literally everything on the internet is p2p...11:39
khertanali1234, yes i know but most phone contrator lock some port/protocol with proxy and other ###@~{^\! things11:40
khertansome even use deep packet inspection methods11:41
ali1234they are not looking for bitcoin though11:41
khertanno but for example Sfr 3G Illymithics contract blocks everything port 80 is proxyed with something that truncate all get/post answer that have answer content type application/zip, and on port 443 for https ... only http protocol is ok, everything else is connection closed11:46
khertans/port/except port11:46
ali1234that is highly unusual11:47
khertanthat usual in france11:47
khertan:)11:47
ali1234i would not accept that from a mobile provider, personally11:47
khertanexcept one provider other play the same game11:47
ali1234but luckily i don't have to beause it literally does not happen in the UK on any network11:47
khertaneven orange ?11:47
ali1234not as far as i'm aware11:47
khertanin france there was an imap option for 5/months they open the imap port11:48
khertanhuhu11:48
ali1234lol11:48
ali1234for a while t-mobile tried that with "chat" protocols11:48
ali1234"pay extra and we unblock MSN"11:48
ali1234but eventually they gave up11:49
khertanbut things are quickly changing currently with the new operator "free mobile" unlimitted sms/voice/data/talk/* for 19,99 / months without duration11:49
khertanso other are losing clients and change strategy11:50
* w00t has no data limit, and is happy with that11:50
ali1234neither do i, not since about 4 years ago11:50
khertanw00t, the data limit isn't the problem ... that the access limit :)11:51
w00thmm?11:51
khertanw00t, youtube isn't accessible with more than a few byte/s :)11:51
w00tyeah, ok, i don't have that :)11:52
khertanof all that for saying that i ll avoid doing p2p for BitPurse in attemps to make it works with all operators :)11:53
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Stskeepshttp://vimeo.com/60547343 - good demo of the emulato12:02
Stskeepsr12:02
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clehey, when Jolla will release armv7hl image ?12:07
clei don't know12:07
Stskeepsnot yet12:08
khertandoes someone can try in a text area to enter <h1>test</h1> look like it freeze the UI on my emulator12:08
Stskeepsenjoy the emulator for now12:08
cleso, we need that image for debug/test12:08
cleok thanks Stskeeps12:08
Stskeepsthe emulator is just as good for that, it's a full OS12:08
Stskeepskhertan: hmm..12:08
khertanStskeeps, that s with the component gallery apps12:09
Stskeepslbt: ^12:09
khertani ll check a 4th time to see if i can understand what happen12:10
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w00tkhertan: so, you enter <h1>test</h1> in a TextField (or TextArea) and it freezes?12:14
khertanStskeeps, sorry for the trouble this time it s works12:14
khertanshould be something else that consume ressource12:14
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khertanpretty strange i reproduce 3 times12:14
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khertanoh ... again12:18
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khertanw00t, compile and launch the qml gallery components, push page TextInput12:19
khertanscroll down to text Area12:19
khertanenter <h1>test</h1>, press enter until text isn't visible ... try to scroll up the text area12:20
khertanand ... at a moment it ll freeze (just before displaying the text line)12:20
khertannot sure the format in the text is the problem12:20
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Yanielmaybe it is just scrolling a text area12:23
YanielI had it once too12:23
Yanielbut was not sure what I did to break it12:23
khertanit s strange the device seems to be doing nothing12:24
khertanlook like it didn't listen anymore the mouse12:24
Yanielscrolling with the mouse wheel?12:24
khertanyep :)12:24
khertani just notice that scrolling with the mouse wheel while focus in text do the same things12:25
Yanielhow about dragging?12:25
khertanafter that pointer didn't answer12:25
khertani ll try ... vm restarting12:25
khertani launch a reboot in the wrong ssh windows12:26
khertan:)12:26
khertanhost of the vm rebooting12:26
w00tat the least, I can't reproduce it with those steps, but I'm not trying in the emulator, and I also probably have a newer silica than the SDK has at the moment, so I'm probably not much use as a datapoint here12:26
sledgestip for your webdesigners: at https://sailfishos.org/ the "At freenode #xyz" could hyperlink to "http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=#xyz"12:28
lbtsledges: yes - it says that in the contact page itself12:28
khertanthat s didn't happen with mouse dragging just only when using srolling with the mouse wheel and focus is in a text input field12:28
lbtbut a bigger tip would be "don't have all the pages as standalone, non-templated, raw html" :/12:29
lbtthus making editing all footers an hour long job!12:29
aslanilbt: you are welcome to jekyll that site if you want12:29
aslanialso jed:in those footers take's 2 minutes?12:30
sledgessed -i PATTERN FILE ... :)12:30
aslanihehe12:30
khertanaslani, you mean pelican12:30
aslaniwellsed12:30
aslaniwell sed I mean12:30
lbtaslani: I'm tempted12:30
Yanielwell sed indeed12:31
lbtjed?12:31
aslanilbt: that was our original intent of course... before few redesigns...12:31
lbt*g* I know12:31
aslanised I meant12:31
khertanlbt raw html is perfect if you didn't want to spend money on huge server just for rendering page :)12:31
lbtoh... I was thinking of emacs multi-edit mode12:31
lbtkhertan: naw - offline generation would be fine12:31
sledgeslol Yaniel12:32
lbtjekyll can do that afaik12:32
khertanlbt, pelican so :12:32
khertan:)12:32
khertanpelican is a jekyll clone ... but better ... of course it s python code12:32
khertan:)12:32
khertan</troll§12:33
khertan>12:33
khertani remember seeing a link 'know issue on the site ... but can't found it'12:33
khertanroh !12:34
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khertanis there a bug tracker ?12:34
lbtI though hyde was the python variant12:35
lbtkhertan: no, not yet12:35
lbtkhertan: you can report bugs against upstream though12:35
khertanlbt, as usual with python there is multiple variant of clone of other language lib12:35
lbtso Mer owns the QtCreator part of SDK and also much of the SDK VM12:36
khertanlbt, not sure, look like a silica components bugs12:36
lbtkhertan: frankly that's likely to be known already and quite possibly fixed12:36
lbtin general report it to the mailing list12:36
lbtwe *do* want bug reports12:37
khertanlet see the archive12:37
khertan:)12:37
lbtwe just don't want to get heavy with a tracker on such dynamic code12:37
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khertanof course i understand12:37
khertanok ... i reproduce the things without silica components12:39
khertanso clearly not that :)12:39
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lbtkhertan: I think I've had that freeze bug during text in the emulator - I had not been able to reproduce it12:40
khertanlbt with current pub or newer release private ?12:41
khertanif newer that probably fixed and so no need to report12:42
khertaneven upstream12:42
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lbtkhertan: I'd report it - but when it happened to me I was not using html tags12:46
lbtiirc it was ~ in scroll area12:46
YanielI had some lorem ipsum12:47
lbtnow I'm dragging on my firefox screen to scroll it :D12:47
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tj____hmm nice that nested virtualization works.. i was able to run the sailfishos virtualbox thing on ubuntu 12.04 running on vmware player running on windows 7 work laptop12:54
khertanlbt, it s freeze without using html tag ... just focus an text field and use the wheel of a mouse to scroll12:54
lbtkhertan: OK - that simply will never have been tried12:55
lbtyah - scroll up with mouse == crash ?12:55
khertanlbt, :p12:56
* lbt edits known issues12:56
khertanlbt, that s not a crash12:56
khertanlook like that x didn't repond anymore to mouse12:56
khertanrespond12:56
khertanor input event12:56
kallela_tj____: are you having 32 or 64-bit ubuntu? I failed to get emulator working on ubuntu 12.04 32-bit inside VirtualBox, hosted by win7 64-bit13:00
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khertanlbt, don't see any error related in xorg logs nor dmesg13:02
lbtjournalctl too13:02
khertandidn't see such log13:03
tj____kallela_, all 64-bit13:03
khertanits a command :)13:03
tj____tj____, windows, ubuntu, sailfishos sdk13:04
tj____i mean kallela_ ;)13:04
kallela_tj____: ok. maybe I'll try 64-bit ubuntu next13:05
khertanlbt, nothing exept XISlaveSwitch13:05
khertan13:05
lbtkhertan: yep13:05
khertanlbt can launch other app from ssh13:06
khertanbut none input answer (mouse or keyboard)13:07
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lbtkhertan: kill mcompositor13:08
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lbtoh tj____ ... congrats :D13:13
khertanlbt, you got it13:13
khertanonce restarted it s works :p13:14
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khertanhbbbbbbhbgtgggggnnnnnnnhhhh nnù*****<µ$13:15
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khertansorry first message of my daugter on irc13:16
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khertan(15 months old)13:16
lbtkhertan: wow - tell her she sounds *just* like my kittens13:16
Yanielshe sure does start early13:16
Dicksonis the source for the "Components" app available? I was looking for the progress indicator components13:17
khertani let the netbook on the sofa13:17
veskuhDickson, yes. Go to Welcome -> Examples -> Sailfiish Silica Component13:17
Dicksonveskuh: thanks!13:22
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ekekuulen kyllä13:42
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miksuhHmm.. looks like Sailfish has no QML LiatItem component. So is there some standard consistent way to add subitem indicator to the list delegate?14:08
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miksuhI mean somethibng kuje > qhich would tell the user that if he touches the list item then sub-view will open14:09
lbtmiksuh: not that I know of : https://sailfishos.org/navigation-article.html14:10
lbtif you feel that's an issue then it may be worth raising on the devel mailing list14:10
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sledgeswhy I can't find the "Design" for QML tab in Sailfish SDK QtCreator ?17:29
Yanielurgh, last time I saw that it was a terrible mess17:30
sledges&) that one looks fine in Mer Platform SDK's QtCreator17:30
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Yanielgood news :)17:36
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lbtsledges: ooh - interesting - I didn't notice we'd actually disabled the design tab17:45
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lbtwe've been discussing whether to spend time on it - my 'market research' (ie asking real Qt/QML app developers) says it's just eye candy at the moment and not useful during real app development17:47
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sledgeslbt, yup, taking my words back: vanilla QtCreator - Design tab works. Mer Platform SDK: Design tab disabled. Sailfish SDK: Design tab gone :)17:47
lbtOne think I'd like to see is better integration with a simple QMLviewer17:47
Yanielit might attract beginners to have a graphical tool17:47
lbtYaniel: yes - that's the argument17:47
* sledges was about to write "I am QML beginner"17:47
lbtthe problem is that it is actually hard to use17:48
sledgesusing vanilla QtCreator atm ;P17:48
Yanielsledges but a programmin beginner?17:48
lbtand we have to choose where/how to focus17:48
Yanielor, say, for example html17:48
sledgesYaniel, no, I'm not beginner in UI design; but would like to know QML inside out in shortest time possible :)17:49
sledgescurrently have a challenging task to dissect lipstick's shutdown screen, so wanted some WYSIWYG17:50
sledgesanyway, how to get rid of import com.nokia.meego 1.017:51
sledges^...'QML module not found' error ?17:51
sledgesqt-components are also loaded, ./configure`d, but having trouble making/building them17:52
sledgeswhereas to get rid of import org.nemomobile.lipstick 0.117:55
sledgesQML module not found was sufficient just to have lipstick.pro loaded into the same project set17:55
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thpso, where do i file a bug / wishlist item in sailfish silica?18:00
fk_lxthp: sailfish mailing list18:00
fk_lxhttps://lists.sailfishos.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devel18:00
fk_lxthat is recommended solution for now as far as I know18:00
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bobweaverWow that is one of the things that I have to say about all your sdk kit just wow18:58
bobweaverany future for qt2.0 ?18:58
bobweaversorry qml 2.0 qt518:59
Stskeepsyes, but shipping beat shiny new technology when we chose direction to go for sailfish 118:59
Stskeepswe still perform extremely well18:59
bobweaversorry I am brancd new to sailfish as of this morning I can not belive that it comes with virtual machines help sections for all elements just amazing19:01
lbtbobweaver: glad you like it :)19:01
bobweaverI am a qt qml developer and would not mind adding some apps but would like to talk about the future and what sail fish is how it was started19:01
lbtthp: yes, mailing list for bugs - we didn't think a bugzilla was right just yet19:01
lbtbobweaver: sure19:02
Stskeepsbobweaver: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jolla is a good story19:02
bobweaverI just do not want to do the same thing that I did with a different OS19:02
lbtbobweaver: MeeGo ?19:02
bobweaverYeah I know some of the meego stuff19:02
bobweaverI just started qml and qt like 1 or 2 years ago19:02
bobweaveroh so it is fork19:02
lbtmmm19:03
Stskeepsi like to think of it as a continuation with modification19:03
Stskeepss19:03
lbtmore of a natural progression19:03
* bobweaver is reading wiki 19:03
lbtbobweaver: checkout the merproject side too (though we would say that :) )19:03
bobweaverI sure am kinda happy that it is qt4.8 so many libs that can be used like BOx2d tiles libdconf-qt ect things that are not going to be ported to 5.019:04
bobweaverquestion:  Are there backers($) for the sailfish.19:06
bobweaverIf I did a bunch of work would I get noticed and is there jobs ?19:06
Stskeepsyes, but practically we only hire qml gods for ui19:07
Stskeepsand yes, it's a company with investments19:07
* bobweaver thinks he is qml god 19:07
Stskeepsyeah, wait until you meet our guys then :)19:08
bobweaverI am sure that they are better then me but I am talented maybe you have seen some of my work ?19:08
Stskeepsnop, but feel free to enlighten19:08
Sfiet_KonstantinQML is a polytheist religion right ?19:11
Sfiet_Konstantinbecause there are quite a lot of QML gods :D19:11
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bobweaverhttps://plus.google.com/u/0/b/104659991254860976283/+UbuntuTV/posts    << that is /me19:12
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Stskeeps:nod:19:12
bobweaverhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9X4dJOMt4k << that is me19:12
Stskeepshope you'll have fun with our SDK :) we certainly had fun making it19:13
bobweaverhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PSb4szE7pw  << that is me 6 days19:13
bobweaveryeah it is fun so far19:13
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bobweaverI use to like to dev for Ubuntu because they would take care of me (fly me to UDS then talk with other devs about future) all that got pulled UDS  so things are changing and I am not happy about it so I quit the team19:15
bobweaverUDS = ubuntu developers summit19:16
Stskeepsi remember my first maemo meetup and my first presentation, was a big thing to go19:17
bobweaverplus things like make ubuntu tv in qml / qt then 6 months later nope we want in unity 3d then 6 months later changing story ect19:17
Stskeepsmet many amazing people i still know today19:17
Stskeepsyeah.. i think most of us in jolla knows the game of changing strategies :)19:19
Sfiet_Konstantinbobweaver: does that mean that 6 month later, ubuntu for phone and tablets will run unity 3D :S ?19:19
valdur55Oh. I really want do some hacking now.... But i must work with my liteature course. I need to write 4 essays :(19:19
Sfiet_KonstantinStskeeps: ...19:19
Stskeepssince many of us got laid off at the windows phone change19:19
Stskeeps:P19:19
lbtbobweaver: you should check out #nemomobile too19:19
* lbt afk for a bit19:19
bobweaveryeah body language is so important. People learn a lot about one maybe like 70% or more about people by there body language. and nothing beets a sit down hacking session19:19
bobweaverbeats *19:20
Sfiet_Konstantinbtw lbt, thanks for that french comment :) didn't know that you know french actually19:20
janievening19:20
Stskeepsi usually say that a drink once in a while with people you spend a lot of time with on irc and sometimes gets frustrated with people, goes a long way to relieve tensions19:20
Stskeeps:P19:20
bobweaverlol19:21
* dm8tbr agrees19:24
yuntaStskeeps: don't tell that to lbt, he may want to relive his tension on me next week ...19:24
dm8tbrf2f 'resync' every once in a while is a necessity19:24
yunta(fist2face)19:24
dm8tbrsounds like someone has been naughty ;)19:25
Stskeepsyunta: paintball game may be a good idea, yeah19:25
yuntatrue (where is amartinez when we need him.....)19:26
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fk_lxit would be great :-)19:32
bobweaverQuestion what is you alls feeling on adding libs to the Sdk ?  Like if I wanted to add some qt.labs stuff other declarative stuff.  will it break the virtual machine ?19:41
bobweavermaybe I should just take qt5.0.1 and try to add Sail fish stuff to that installer. Or are there things like that happening already ? thanks19:41
bobweaverI was going to port some of my apps to sailfish but I would need to compile other libs.(partials shaders gesture folderlistmodel Localstorage )19:43
dm8tbrI think there is Qt5 for mer/nemo, so it shouldn't be too hard19:43
dm8tbras the sdk is built on top of that19:43
bobweaversource is on git ?19:44
bobweaverNM I found it19:45
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Stskeepsbobweaver: feel free to screw around the emulator as you want or targets, but make a backup to revert easier :)19:53
bobweaverStskeeps, Do you know where one would go to request things be added to the sdk ?19:53
Stskeepsbobweaver: i think the sdk will probably always match with what apis we'll support19:54
bobweavermainly qt.labs19:54
bobweaverI mean I could make Snow happen alot more fancy with qt.labs.partials then taking a image and moving it around with JS19:55
RzRhi lbt19:55
bobweaverlike for weather app19:55
Stskeepsbobweaver: qt.labs.partials? URL?19:55
RzRjust copied the plugin off http://jolla.cachefly.net/SailfishOSSDK/alpha/installers/SailfishOSSDK-linux-32-offline.run to target19:55
RzRit works19:55
RzRi feel this should part on the target image19:56
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yuntaare those plugins like... normal libs?19:58
w00tStskeeps: i think he means particles :)19:59
Stskeepsparticles i think we should have19:59
Stskeepsi might be wrong19:59
Stskeepsin qt5 for sure19:59
w00tStskeeps: not unless something pulls it into the image19:59
bobweaverStskeeps, http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/docs/library/html/qt4/qml-particles.html20:01
bobweaverStskeeps,  comes by default in qt5 but is different area and alot more fancy20:01
bobweaveralot more work was done to it20:02
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bobweaverlike shaders also20:02
bobweaverStskeeps,  there is sailfish qt 5 ?  can I download ?20:04
Stskeepsbobweaver: zypper search qt520:04
bobweaverthanks20:05
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Stskeepsjust be aware that it's a bit untested land on the emulator20:06
Stskeepsit should work but there's no qml components for it20:06
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bobweaveryeah this emulator in qtcreator is still blowing my mind.  You all did such a good job on that20:09
bobweaverno setting up qemu it is awesome20:09
Stskeepshard to believe it's all sw rendering isn't it?20:10
bobweaverlol20:10
Stskeepsno fancy virtualbox acceleration in use20:10
bobweaveralso the help options for you all made are awesome also20:11
bobweaverthe packing for rpm is also nice though I am a deb guy :( where is my control file ! lol just playing around20:12
YanielI like the fact that there is a UI style guide20:12
Stskeepsi started with deb, i've grown fond of rpm20:12
Yanielalthough that could be a bit more detailed20:12
Yanieland I don't really care about deb or rpm20:13
w00tYaniel: early days.. make sure to send a mail to the list about what you'd like to see :)20:14
Yanielyeah20:14
bobweaveryeah that is the classic "holy war" I just think that it is cool how there is great that there is set up for it at start of project20:15
Yanielthe Apple HIG was the first thing that came to my mind when I checked out the sailfish page20:15
Yanielthat kind of document is surprisingly important20:17
spider-marioindeed20:17
spider-mariowithout them, you end up with android 2-20:17
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Yanielyeah20:19
spider-mariookay, I’m a bit of a backbiter. :p20:19
Yanielwell, most people probably won't bother reading it20:19
Yanielbut having it around certainly helps keep apps behave consistently20:20
spider-mariowell, Sailfish’s UI principles are sufficiently interesting to make it desirable to follow them20:20
spider-marioI think the pullable menu is a great idea, for example20:21
Yanieland that is much easier with a document describing it in detail20:21
spider-mariolast night, I even dreamt that I showed it to someone else :D20:21
spider-mario(it was a minor part of the dream, but still.)20:21
Yaniel:D20:21
Yanielon an unrelated note: I wonder how many sailfish devs there will be by the time there is an actual device for them20:22
spider-marioI wonder if that number will increase or decrease if it takes long20:23
spider-marioand I hope it won’t20:23
spider-mario(I’ll still wait as long as necessary, though)20:24
spider-mario(I’m not impatient, just excited. :D)20:24
* w00t is happy with the SDK reception so far at least :)20:25
fk_lx:-)20:26
* w00t resumes the evening's hacking20:32
bobweaverOh my .... TextEdit brings up key board how cool is that !20:34
RzRyes it is20:34
spider-marioI *love* what I am seeing in the emulator20:36
spider-marioI am really looking forward to being able to buy an actual device running that. :D20:36
fk_lxspider-mario: I guess we will have to wait for that still some months20:36
spider-marioI can wait :)20:37
spider-marioespecially knowing how awesome it will be when it’s done20:37
RzRdoes your app use toolbars ?20:37
RzRa guide to port harmattan / symbian / cascades to Silica would be welcome20:39
RzRbut for a developer point of view I prefer cascades to others20:39
RzRfrom ..20:39
spider-mariothe time picker looks futuristic. :D20:40
RzRsomeone should make a video of all components20:41
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bobweaverRzR, +120:46
bobweavermake some sed scripts maybe also for changing app for say qt2 to qt1 and also things like listview gridviews ect20:47
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* lbt wanders back in20:56
lbtSfiet_Konstantin: hey ... good timing too. Yes, I love France :)20:57
Sfiet_Konstantin:)20:57
Sfiet_Konstantinnice20:57
Yanielquite impressive the video about the ubuntu phone calculator ported to sailfish20:57
Sfiet_Konstantinyeah20:57
lbtWas over in Aix-les-Bains last year doing some work and managed to find some lovely french Tango dancers ;)20:58
lbtit is - we need somewhere to share stuff though20:58
lbtThere's no app store - it's simply too early - but the community could pull kind of repo together20:58
RzRdont stare at me :)20:58
lbthehe20:58
Yanielsomething like AUR?20:59
RzRdid u read what i wrote above20:59
lbtActually I wonder if we could do it around Nemo20:59
lbtRzR: no... just about to scroll back20:59
RzRuploading labs .so from 32bit sdk to target somehow work20:59
* lbt lets yunta know that he has something special planned for him....21:00
* special puts on a pretty dress21:01
Yanieloh my, that nick is actually in use? :D21:01
Sfiet_Konstantinlol21:01
Sfiet_Konstantinof cause :D21:01
lbtand wouldn't you know we got him ... and he's awake for once!21:02
RzRwho is lol ? =P21:02
lbtRzR: trying to follow your thread... not doing well21:02
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lbtare we talking copying Qt labs .so to the SDK target? That should indeed work21:03
RzRcd ~/SailfishOS/bin/Qt && tar cfv - labs | ssh  root@localhost -p 2223 -i ~/.ssh/mer-qt-creator-rsa  tar xfv - -C /usr/lib/qt4/imports/Qt/21:04
lbtyou may want to do a 'sync' to let QtCreator know about the QML files too21:04
RzRgot it ?21:04
lbtmanual install to emulator21:04
lbtright - you may want to install to the SDK target too when there are Component files that you want QtC to know about (eg for auto-completion)21:05
bobweaverQuestion How to make the keyboard go away after textedit area is hidden ?  is there a function for that ?21:06
lbtthat's a little more tricky21:06
bobweaverthanks ^^21:06
lbtbobweaver: drag it down21:06
specialbobweaver: programmatically? remove focus, by giving it to something else or doing textField.focus = false21:06
lbtI should say "pull" it down21:07
RzRswipe it down :)21:07
lbt:O21:07
Sfiet_KonstantinRzR: swipe is so 201121:07
lbtyou can't say that here!21:07
Sfiet_Konstantinnow it is pull and push21:07
Sfiet_Konstantinit is push down21:07
Yaniel2011? is it that old?21:07
lbtnah... pull21:07
Yanieltime sure flies21:07
lbtpush is from 'outside' the screen Sfiet_Konstantin21:07
Sfiet_Konstantinwoops, pull21:08
Sfiet_Konstantinpull it is21:08
lbtSfiet_Konstantin: can you guess who proof read the design text?21:08
bobweaverSweet !  http://imagebin.org/24837321:08
Sfiet_Konstantinlbt: haha21:08
RzRhole in the screen ?21:08
lbtand removed the "swipes" and "drags" we had in there :)21:08
Sfiet_Konstantin2011 it is ... quite old21:08
RzRso we all are21:09
Sfiet_Konstantinbobweaver: oooh, the wonderful animated weather demo21:09
Sfiet_Konstantinlove it21:09
bobweaverthat is not the one that you are thinking of I just used there  artwork21:09
Sfiet_Konstantinbobweaver: :)21:09
Sfiet_Konstantinok21:09
bobweaverit has sql databases and what not to store you citys and well where o push code ?21:10
bobweavers|o|to21:10
lbtnb .. if it's in here: http://gitweb.merproject.org/gitweb/  you can get it (at the moment!)21:11
lbtwe need to list the exact APIs at some point - and we'll definitely want community comments21:11
lbthehe ... my wife made the cover on her app pink21:12
lbtI wondered why she's been quiet21:12
lbtalso confirms ubuntu 11.04 works with SDK21:12
Sfiet_Konstantinlbt: the demo app pink ? :D21:13
lbtyeah21:14
Sfiet_Konstantin:D21:14
Sfiet_KonstantinBlue is better :P21:14
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Palihi, will be sailfish SDK vcs (git, svn, ..) repos public?21:26
Palior always only one monolitic SDK installer?21:26
Yanielgood question21:28
lbtPali: it's been developed in the open21:30
Palilbt, what that means?21:30
Paliis SDK already in git?21:31
lbtsec21:31
lbthttps://qt.gitorious.org/+mer-qt-creator/qt-creator/mer-qt-creator/commits/mer21:31
lbtit's updated most and the teams share code via a public git21:32
Yanielthat does not contain emulator & build wm, right?21:32
lbtso the emulator is SailfishOS ... and that's built on Mer and Nemo21:33
lbtthe build engine is based on the Mer SDK21:33
lbthttp://gitweb.merproject.org/gitweb/ contains Mer Core packages21:33
lbthttps://github.com/mer-tools21:33
lbthas many of the SDK tools (Control Center and various other things)21:34
lbtObviously we know that SailfishOS has some parts that aren't open yet and some that will never be open21:34
lbt(well, never say never)21:35
lbtSo you can build something very close indeed to the SailfishOS SDK with open code21:35
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lbtthe logos and name are not open - otherwise people could claim that their modified package was "SailfishOS SDK"21:36
Palilbt, is there list of components which are closed?21:36
lbtnot afaik21:36
Paliand do you know some parts which are closed?21:37
Jonnimost likely he cannot comment on that yet even if he knew21:38
lbthe's right :)21:39
Paliok21:39
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laze76hm port (at least preview) of sailfish to n9 or nexus would be most welcome while waiting offical phone21:56
yuntawe won't21:57
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bobweaverHello there again. I am seeming to not be able to use Qt.formatDateTime  has any one else had this issue ?22:47
bobweaverexample             Text {text: Qt.formatDateTime(timeFrom,"dddd d MMMM") }   where timeFrom is comming from a model (xmlrole)22:50
mvogtbobweaver: I haven't seen this problem, but I always use the Silica.FOrmatter component for localized time strings22:53
bobweaverand Yup timeFrom 100% works if I am to do  Text{text: timeFrom} It returns the iso899022:53
bobweaverThat function mvogt  will take iso8601 (or what ever the numbers are) and convert the time ?22:53
bobweaverlet me take a scrennie22:54
bobweaverhttp://imagebin.org/24837922:55
bobweaverI even tried to wrap timeFrom in a function and return it then call that still nadda :( JS time it looks like22:57
mvogtbobweaver: try formatDateTime() without a format value22:59
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bobweavermvogt,  no deals for the wicked23:01
bobweaver:/23:01
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vgradehttps://twitter.com/vgrade/status/306831031686803456/photo/1 , any tips to get lipstick from not chopping the bottom off and filling the screen?23:03
vgradelooks like its trying to maintain an aspect on this display23:04
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mvogtbobweaver: I just modified the silica componentgallery to use "return Qt.formatDateTime(dateTime)" in the timestamp() function in the FormatterPage23:06
mvogtbobweaver: this works for me , so maybe there's a locale issue?23:06
w00tvgrade: it's not lipstick's fault, the version of silica you have now is probably not looking at the display size23:06
w00tthat was changed recently, but I doubt it's yet been released23:06
bobweavermvogt,  not sure I am making a video of it so you all know that I am not trolling    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2Yn2UEVEDM23:07
mvogtbobweaver: no need for video, I believe you :)23:08
thplbt: i'll collect my nitpicks as a blog post in the next few days. and maybe also post to the mailing list..23:08
vgradew00t: cheers23:08
w00tthp: uh oh ;)23:09
lbtthp: ok - please post to the ml though - it'll be the place I go through to triage stuff :)23:09
thplbt: will do :)23:11
fk_lx:-)23:11
lbtlooks like mvogt sorted that out bobweaver23:11
mvogtlbt: what? still trying to reproduce...23:11
bobweavermvogt,  want code to try out ?23:12
lbtoh, I misunderstood your reply mvogt23:12
bobweaverit is gpl3+23:12
mvogtbobweaver: actually, I just want to try using formatDatetime in the componentgallery app in the SDK23:12
* lbt wonders if QML code snippets as patches to the template would be a good way to report bugs23:14
bobweavercreate a string as a var in a pragma lib call the var in Text ?  string would be something like 2013-02-27T1:00:0023:15
bobweaverfor recreation that is ^^23:16
vgradew00t: did the display size go into qml at /usr/lib/qt4/imports/Sailfish/Silica/*23:16
w00tvgrade: no, it's C++-side23:17
vgradew00t: ah ok, nothing I can do then23:17
w00tyou can try to trick it in QML, but I don't know how much luck you'd have23:18
vgradew00t: I'd need to learn QML first as well :)23:18
w00tc'mon, it's not that bad ;)23:19
vgradew00t: don't have the first idea really23:19
vgradew00t: I guess I/m looking for something in page.qml23:21
mvogtbobweaver: right, so I just got the componentgallery example running in ths SDK - Qt.formatDateTime() works in that context23:21
* bobweaver pulls hair out *Oo*23:22
bobweaver:)23:22
mvogtbobweaver: so it isn't a general problem - is it a QDateTime your model is returning?23:22
bobweavernah it is comming from xml a qpi23:23
bobweaverapi *23:23
mvogtmaybe you need to convert to JS Date object before calling Qt.formatDateTime?23:23
bobweaverOk I will try that23:24
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w00tvgrade: ApplicationWindow.qml is probably a good place to look23:26
vgradew00t: just found that23:26
vgradethanks23:27
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bobweaverstill nothing mvogt  I am going to write a function23:39
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mvogtbobweaver: what format is timestamp data in?23:47
bobweaveriso860123:48
bobweaversorry me and enter happy . iso8601 --> string (then I have tried to make into date formate and also tried string)23:49
mvogtbobweaver: complicated, because JS doesn't really support it natively - you need your own parsing to convert it into a JS Date23:49
bobweaveryeah that is what I thought also but then I tried that and even tried old function that converts to  string iso8601 to nice looking string. also tried in just qmlscence and that ran and did what I told it to in both qml 1 and 223:51
bobweaverHere is data model  http://pastebin.com/fJVyE9ga   Here is old javascript function  http://pastebin.com/SUnqz00v    Here is element http://pastebin.com/XmtDR7EB23:55
mvogtbobweaver: this is a relatively simple conversion function that works for me (TM): http://anentropic.wordpress.com/2009/06/25/javascript-iso8601-parser-and-pretty-dates/23:55
bobweaverYeah that is v.close to the function that I tried as backup I will try that23:57
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mvogtbobweaver: http://pastebin.com/K0GwK5qx - should be enough, once you have working parsing function23:58
bobweaverthanks mvogt  :)23:59

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