18:08:05 #startmeeting 18:08:05 Meeting started Mon Aug 19 18:08:05 2013 UTC. The chair is dm8tbr. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Meetings. 18:08:05 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 18:08:14 but Merbot is also on #dolphinaric 18:08:17 ah ? 18:08:20 #endmeeting 18:08:24 :( 18:08:30 who will chair? 18:08:53 no THIS is the meeting channel 18:08:58 ok 18:09:04 dm8tbr: maybe fk_lx ? 18:09:13 please no meetings on other channels 18:09:24 dm8tbr: understood 18:09:24 #chair fk_lx 18:09:24 Current chairs: dm8tbr fk_lx 18:09:30 dm8tbr: what is the reason for that? 18:09:46 my bus will arrive shortly 18:10:15 you chose the day where I'm on my way back home... 18:10:37 I see 18:11:09 i'll try to check in here in 5min,once on the bus 18:11:14 oh ok 18:12:43 maybe let's wait for dm8tbr 18:13:39 fk_lx: yes 18:14:45 Sfiet_Konstantin: can you by the way tell me what useful features has Merbot 18:15:01 I know it's good for bug triages, but for normal meetings 18:15:14 fk_lx: I don't know :/ 18:15:14 it is useful for meeting 18:15:15 back 18:15:23 I don't have a lot of knowledge about that 18:15:23 :-) 18:15:36 I gave you the link to the howto a while ago 18:15:45 dm8tbr: mind resending it ? :D 18:16:08 https://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot 18:16:51 dm8tbr: thanks 18:17:00 http://meetbot.debian.net/Manual.html too 18:17:33 there is also generic functionality by supybot 18:17:51 but that's more a thing for other channels 18:17:59 oh, it also integrates with bug trackers 18:18:38 dm8tbr: good feature :) 18:18:48 but well, we might not talk about bugs here (yet ?) :) 18:19:00 yep :-) 18:19:09 so, what's the meeting about? 18:19:15 any agenda? 18:19:26 there are some points to discuss 18:19:44 list them and hten go through them one by one using #topic foobar 18:20:28 I have about 10min on the bus left. then I'll disappear for good as I'll arrive at home and I'm in need of sauna/shower/food and sleep 18:20:45 so anything that needs me, please in first order 18:21:07 dm8tbr: ok, understtod 18:21:11 *understood 18:21:18 :) 18:21:48 there are general two topics I would like to discuss 18:22:00 but I also don't want to be strict 18:22:08 we haven't met for long time 18:22:23 fk_lx: maybe start with the topics, and finish with a category misc 18:22:31 ok 18:22:31 or ask if anyone have another topic ? 18:22:36 * dm8tbr seconds 18:23:09 so one of the topics is the installfests and organizing more of these kinds of events 18:23:34 and another one is regarding materials used 18:23:44 fk_lx: use #topic to set a topic :) 18:23:53 hint: #topic installfests, and organizing more of those 18:24:05 (only chairs can set that) 18:24:16 ok, sorry I'm a bit laggy 18:24:21 was quite distracted at beginning 18:24:40 #topic installfests and organizing more of those 18:24:54 hum ? 18:25:15 #topic installfests and organizing more of those 18:25:56 ah 18:26:03 right 18:26:05 :/ 18:26:20 thanks 18:26:20 proceed 18:26:31 topic is set (just not in irc topic 18:26:37 ok :-) 18:26:40 thanks :) 18:26:42 I'm popping of the bus in 3-4min 18:26:47 ok 18:26:54 anywho, we need a date for poznań 18:26:57 dm8tbr: we can manage I think :) 18:27:07 dm8tbr: we do but that guy didn't answer 18:27:07 * cybette is here, crashing the meeting 18:27:13 :] 18:27:20 cybette: :D 18:27:32 I thinking about organizing such events also in Western Europe 18:27:40 I already contacted C-Base in Berlin 18:27:44 I would love to do something in fr 18:27:48 good target 18:27:55 I know also Hydrogene wants to organize an event 18:27:58 he is here 18:28:01 also other places like CCCC 18:28:07 in Laval (it's in France) 18:28:11 in laval ? 18:28:16 I'm off 18:28:22 dm8tbr: ok 18:28:22 that's a bit far from paris, but I could support him 18:28:24 could be nice 18:28:28 I'll read log later 18:28:42 Sfiet_Konstantin: I also thought about doing sth in Paris in addition to Laval 18:29:00 and really support of other people is needed 18:29:02 will try to seek help when I'm back 18:29:16 Sfiet_Konstantin, I can also move to Paris to give some help, it's not so far ;) 18:29:16 especially that when the "rentrée" will come (september) 18:29:16 because there are generally few things that need to be done to prepare such kind of events 18:29:22 there will be a lot of activity 18:29:30 Hydrogene: I can come to laval if it is not too far too :) 18:29:46 I think it would be good to do such event in both Paris and Laval 18:29:57 indeed 18:30:02 by doing more we prepare better 18:30:06 Hydrogene: we could plan together 18:30:12 that would be great :-) 18:30:32 but not before september for me 18:30:36 I also will have some time in September, more likely in second half of it 18:30:50 Hydrogene: what was the time you was targetting ? 18:30:59 fk_lx: :) 18:31:19 anyway we need more and better planning and more in advance 18:31:31 because for now in most cases there was only a week in advance 18:31:39 that's not much 18:31:45 yup 18:31:58 a wiki page would help too 18:32:01 listing plannings 18:32:12 Because venues are mostly hackerspaces for now 18:32:12 Sfiet_Konstantin, don't know yet, it will depend with who and where. But I would prefer second part of September 18:32:22 +1 for the wiki 18:32:24 Hydrogene: ok 18:32:29 it would be good to have a person who would contact hackerspaces regarding the places 18:32:38 I mean reserve dates and room 18:32:51 I still need to be back to paris and seek help and way to organize that, so second part of sep sounds good for me too 18:33:11 fk_lx: yes, but I don't know hackspaces in paris sadly 18:33:14 will try to seek info 18:33:35 for now I'm did it myself in case of Warsaw, Bratislava and Budapest, but someone could really take care of contacting those 18:34:21 Sfiet_Konstantin: I also didn't almost know anyone in case of Bratislava and Budapest - just used contact mail on the hackerspaces websites or lists 18:34:28 ok 18:34:33 good to know 18:34:53 but that takes time and contacting, tracing the progress, preparing presentations etc. at the same time it's too much 18:34:57 fk_lx: another thing is to find other people doing the same in other countries 18:35:00 indeed 18:35:30 in fr, it seems that we are at least 2, so it might be easier for us 18:35:41 Sfiet_Konstantin: yep, but from my experience there are people interested in conducting such events, have proper knowledge etc. 18:35:47 but in a small group (< 5) we won't get too far 18:35:53 indeed 18:36:00 hey you guys, you can use #info, #agreed, #action etc. to document the meeting better 18:36:01 but then they say that they don't know how to find venue 18:36:13 cybette: yes, but now, it is informal discussion 18:36:13 I can help in Czechia. 18:36:14 :) 18:36:29 fk_lx: that's the problem, our community is small, so maybe we should restrain ourselves in not too much events 18:36:30 so I think we need a person that will only take care of arranging venues 18:36:36 so some kind of specialization 18:36:44 ok, just a suggestion. i left for a couple minutes and came back to a flood :) wanted to get a summary... 18:36:51 fk_lx: do you think ? I'm not really sure, especially because there is a language barrier 18:36:59 cybette: :D 18:37:23 Sfiet_Konstantin: is it? writing mails in English to hackerspaces did work for me 18:37:25 fk_lx: shouldn't it be better if you have one people in charge of a country, or part of a country 18:37:26 cybette: :-) 18:37:28 fk_lx: ok 18:37:51 still, IMO, we are not enough to have one person in charge of writing mails 18:37:51 Sfiet_Konstantin: but some people say that they completely don't know how to find a venue 18:38:18 Sfiet_Konstantin: but they would be able to conduct such event if someone would take care of finding venue for them 18:38:32 ah 18:38:32 some people may not have event planning experiece. might be good to have a template for asking about venue, sponsorship etc. 18:38:43 +1 cybette 18:38:43 cybette: exactly :-) 18:38:51 cybette: that is what I wanted to suggest 18:39:07 :) 18:39:09 fk_lx: so basically docs in that part ? 18:39:27 also it should be easier now, because we have a page with lists of events, and for hackerspaces it's a positive signal if an event was done in other hackerspaces 18:39:34 :) 18:39:37 yeah, that's true 18:39:44 they are more likely to agree without too much thinking 18:40:11 :) 18:40:55 besides I can tell you that hackerspaces are very open to supporting that kind of event in many different ways 18:41:07 like providing place to sleep for travelling installfest organizer 18:41:14 for good meeting minutes: http://meetbot.debian.net/Manual.html 18:41:49 fk_lx: :) 18:42:03 fk_lx: mind doing summary of the meeting ? 18:42:07 I had offers after the event, that if I would repeat such event it wouldn't be a problem to couchsurf by one of the hackerspace members 18:42:16 like #info ? 18:42:34 I'm really not familiar with the MerBot, sorry 18:42:47 so you have to forgive me 18:42:52 just write "#info we should write a wiki page for something" 18:43:04 "#info we should maintain a list" 18:43:14 ah ok, thanks for help :-) 18:43:22 #info we should write a wiki page for something 18:43:27 lol :D 18:43:29 #info we should maintain a list 18:43:30 :D 18:43:33 :D 18:43:46 and you can use #action irc_nick to do this and that 18:43:59 and it will make a nice collection of action items for each irc_nick 18:44:13 ok :-) 18:44:18 and #agreed for something that we agreed to do 18:44:21 #action fk_lx will learn how to use meetbot (-; 18:44:30 yes! lol 18:44:55 :-) 18:45:44 xmlich02: you said sth about doing event in Czech Republic 18:46:01 yes 18:46:04 Regarding the venue, we can possibly arrange workshop during linuxalt conference (first weekend in November). Next, the Red Hat in Brno can provide a "tower presentation room" (hopefully) 18:46:06 i think #action and #info lines can be by anyone, but #agreed command is chair only 18:46:42 sounds great, I've also considered going to Brno for LinuxAlt 18:47:17 so I can support that action also - I'm getting better and better at understanding Czech and Slovak language ;-) 18:47:45 can we set people responsible for each events, like 18:48:00 fk_lx: ok 18:48:00 Paris - Sfiet_Konstantin, Laval - Hydrogene, Brno - xmlich02 18:48:08 fk_lx: +1 18:48:29 #info Paris - Sfiet_Konstantin, Laval - Hydrogene, Brno - xmlich02 18:48:30 ;-) 18:48:47 fk_lx: :) 18:49:18 #info Berlin, Wrocław - fk_lx 18:49:47 anyone more here willing to organize such event? 18:50:13 or aiding existing one 18:50:50 I can ask for the venue, but I am not sure if I can prepare whole workshop by myself. It is not problem to have workshop in English. What is estimated duration of such workshop? 18:51:07 xmlich02: first of all there are plans of different event 18:51:09 s 18:51:17 one is installfest - so some basic stuff 18:51:20 more like introduction 18:51:29 and there is also need for something more advanced 18:51:44 in the installfests we only showed some basic things 18:52:02 like the application code looks 18:52:05 what are pages 18:52:22 example Hello Sailors app was discussed as example of that 18:53:09 also some other examples 18:53:15 from Joona presentation 18:54:00 but I think kind of workshop, where people would get a large portion of practical knowledge in creating presentation would be good 18:54:42 but that requires more preparation as this kind of workshop should last half a day 18:54:53 so it all depends what you want to do 18:55:35 I think kind of installfest thing don't require that much time preparation, so we could do some of those still in the last week of August 18:55:49 and yes there is another thing btw. 18:55:53 that I need to mention 18:56:23 there is a lack of place with two-directional communication for local communities 18:56:35 for now people can discuss Sailfish related stuff 18:56:35 fk_lx: +1 18:56:40 either on the mailing list 18:57:02 which might not be a welcoming place for complete beginners, or they might not feel comfortable there 18:57:49 Twitter account like Jolla[put your country here" are very nice, but for one way communication, more for announcing and simple Q&A than for real discussions 18:57:51 I should write an abstract for CfP soon. 18:58:24 so we discussed with dm8tbr 18:58:45 an idea of creating national mailing list, and we already did it and they were announced at local events 18:58:59 and already some people subscribed 18:59:07 fk_lx: good 18:59:19 I think it will be comfortable for Bulgarians to speak in Bulgarian etc. 18:59:26 more people will get involved that way 19:00:10 http://lists.dolphinaric.org/mailman/listinfo 19:00:27 so we created few for those countries where there was already install/hackfest 19:00:51 or was planned to be 19:01:07 fk_lx: great 19:01:14 worth mentioning it in #info 19:01:57 #info mailinglists for people interested in discussing Sailfish (including development) in their local communities, in own languages 19:04:21 if there would be anyone in creating new ones, or being a moderator feel free to discuss that on the dolphinaric mailing list 19:04:28 or even here 19:04:30 now :-) 19:05:10 xmlich02: sailfish-cz, Sfiet_Konstantin, Hydrogene: sailfish-fr? 19:05:15 french community have quite a few enthusiasts for Jolla, but I didn't found much developers 19:05:31 we are some, but don't think that we need a ML now 19:05:34 Sfiet_Konstantin: it's not only for developers 19:05:40 fk_lx, can you send a full url? 19:05:57 since we are already meeting on IRC or on twitter 19:06:03 fk_lx: define the targetted audience ? 19:06:38 people interested in learning / developing for sailfishos / nemo / mer ? 19:06:39 xmlich02: list must be created (dm8tbr can do that) but I'm already looking for moderators 19:07:08 Sfiet_Konstantin: local community (including developers, hobbyst, or people that would want to get any information or discuss stuff that doesn't fit in 140 chars) 19:07:12 oh I missed few lines of irc 19:07:21 xmlich02: no problem :-) 19:07:26 I can be moderator of cz list 19:07:33 xmlich02: great 19:07:33 fk_lx: then a fr is required I guess 19:07:53 #info sailfish-cz ML moderator -> xmlich02 19:07:56 there are enthusiasts around here. In JollaFr we are thinking about setting a forum, but a ML will do 19:08:17 fk_lx: you can give me the moderation of sailfish-fr if needed 19:08:28 #info sailfish-fr ML moderator -> Sfiet_Konstantin 19:09:52 Sfiet_Konstantin: to adress ML vs forum stuff, we thought about using some web based forum like interface 19:10:18 Sfiet_Konstantin: there are such kind of things for Mailman already 19:10:46 fk_lx: awesome ! 19:11:01 at first a ML would be nice 19:11:12 and if there is a web frontend then it is really awesome 19:11:36 Sfiet_Konstantin: yep :-) 19:11:37 because that forum thing is rather a pain for us (jollafr cannot handle a forum now) 19:12:14 fk_lx: maybe we should move forward ? 19:12:19 Sfiet_Konstantin: sure 19:12:23 I will just ask only 19:12:27 if there is someone here 19:12:50 who would like sailfish-your_country_that_wasnt_mentioned_mailing_list 19:14:05 ok 19:14:14 I think we can proceed forward then 19:14:24 just in case 19:14:40 if anyone wants to add sth to topics already discussed then shout 19:14:42 :-) 19:14:49 :) 19:15:00 and the last thing are materials 19:15:09 we really to make those better 19:15:25 fk_lx: topic 19:15:25 that would also include some notes from speakers 19:15:25 *for 19:15:25 for speakers 19:15:50 fk_lx: #topic materials 19:15:53 #topic materials for dolphinaric project, including installfest 19:15:59 :) 19:16:24 so regarding materials 19:16:51 it would be good to make one solid presentation 19:17:02 fk_lx: requirements for a solid presentation ? 19:17:13 (about that I pushed a mini project in Qt to parse QML and make color highlighting for the Qt QML presentation and for latex documents, could be handy) 19:17:18 because for now it's more like jumbing between those 19:17:38 ok 19:17:59 what is needed are speakers/installfest conductors notes 19:18:08 what to do when, tips etc. 19:18:22 for the installfests to be well prepared 19:18:41 that will also encourage more people to organize such events 19:18:54 if it will be clear what they have to do on events, and what to say when 19:18:58 :-) 19:19:02 yep, good idea :) 19:19:17 of course own invention is appreciated, but some tips, notes would be really useful 19:19:41 there was some rendudancy in presentations and QML presentation 19:19:44 indeed 19:19:54 and in my opinion QML presentation is very nice 19:19:58 but .... 19:20:56 for now I'm not convinced to that format 19:20:56 even though it looks great 19:20:59 and is good to get an idea of QML possibilites (presentation about QML in QML - really cool stuff) 19:21:20 fk_lx: well, the problem is that ... it do not generates slides 19:21:21 but it has it's own flaws 19:21:48 like if you are changing slide 19:22:07 and you will hit for next slide again while the slide is being changed 19:22:15 you will run into a bug 19:22:23 fk_lx: yeah, it might be a known bug 19:22:27 need to investigate on that 19:22:43 I think it's not hard to fix it - thought about two solutioins 19:22:56 but anyway 19:23:44 we need really doing a good plan of presentation and each slides and provide notes 19:24:18 yes 19:24:20 Hydrogene: hi again 19:25:13 Hi again. I was joking with ip over avian carriers some times ago, now I'm sure it would be better. 19:25:22 :-) 19:25:25 #info need to have a good plan of the presentation and provide notes 19:25:35 #agreed 19:25:39 :-) 19:25:42 :) 19:26:05 fk_lx: the QML module I pushed on github is nice to do live coding 19:26:10 so do the QML presentation 19:26:19 maybe we should only fire it for showing QML capabilities 19:26:20 Sfiet_Konstantin: but I think sth got broken 19:26:33 Sfiet_Konstantin: I mean there was live coding slide with rectangle 19:26:47 Sfiet_Konstantin: which doesn't displays properly anymore 19:26:51 fk_lx: hum 19:27:07 will hjave to investigate, please ping me again in another day 19:27:07 Sfiet_Konstantin: for me it wasn't a problem, I just launched QtCreator with Qt5 and showed it in IDE 19:27:55 Ok, anyone willing to help with materials? 19:28:13 making them better :-) 19:28:16 still here, but I'm busy with quite a lot of stuff these days 19:28:30 I'm writing a simple QML doc in LaTeX for example, but can help with presentation 19:28:46 however, we will need to have notes and agree on a plan 19:29:06 I'm not sure I can help because I'm still not learning lot of stuff everyday, but if I can, I will ;) 19:29:15 *-not 19:29:34 Hydrogene: you can help a lot, because you have PoV of person who is not an expert yet 19:29:42 or seasoned veteran :-) 19:30:37 btw. as a side not - ambiance feature in Saiilfish usually doesn't impress people at all 19:30:43 in people's opinion - interesting, but overrated 19:30:56 fk_lx: it is a feature that is fun to play with, but not to promote 19:30:58 but it's a side note from the already done events 19:31:02 ok :) 19:31:25 I prefer to promote multitask and general design of ui (no useless spaces, focus on content, swipe to back) 19:32:16 anyway I think we discussed everything what was supposed to be discussed 19:32:19 anyone has sth to add 19:32:20 ? 19:32:38 #info ambiance don't seems to be a killer feature 19:32:58 fk_lx: for me it is ok 19:33:01 #agreed 19:33:38 no more things, so 19:33:41 end meeting in 5 19:33:43 4 19:33:44 3 19:33:46 2 19:33:48 ok, so if someone still wants to chat, let's move to #dolphinaric 19:33:48 1 19:33:53 #endmeeting