09:00:05 <Jaymzz> #startmeeting Sailfish OS, open source, collaboration – 9th of January 2020
09:00:05 <merbot`> Meeting started Thu Jan  9 09:00:05 2020 UTC.  The chair is Jaymzz. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Meetings.
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09:00:50 <Jaymzz> oh well the bot isn't showing that its registering my commands, but as we've seen before, they will show up in the minutes.
09:01:07 <Jaymzz> #info Meeting information and agenda can be found here: https://lists.sailfishos.org/pipermail/devel/2020-January/009043.html
09:01:16 <Jaymzz> I am the meeting’s chairperson today, and will be doing my best to keep time and order. Please behave, respect the timings and be gentle.
09:01:36 <Jaymzz> #topic Brief introduction (5 min). Please prefix your name/handle with # info
09:01:45 <Jaymzz> #info James Noori - sailor @ Jolla
09:01:58 <ViGe> #info Ville Nummela - sailor @ Jolla
09:02:15 <ljo> #info Leif-Jöran Olsson, community
09:03:27 <flypig> #info David Llewellyn-Jones - sailor @ jolla
09:03:57 <abranson> #info Andrew Branson - sailor @ Jolla
09:05:07 <Jaymzz> We also have ApBBB who still can't post here for some reason even after registration.
09:05:16 <Thaodan_> #info Björn Bidar - community developer
09:05:22 <Jaymzz> #info ApBBB - community
09:05:51 <ExTechOp> #info Otto Mäkelä, community
09:06:29 <vknecht> #info Vincent Knecht - community
09:06:40 <dcaliste> #info Damien Caliste, community
09:07:13 <Jaymzz> #topic Fingerprint support for community ported devices (10 min – asked by ApBBB)
09:07:24 <Jaymzz> #info The fingerprint support for officially supported devices is a closed component of SFOS. Community ported phones will have to implement the code from scratch in order to use the fingerprint functionality. This means duplicated work and development time taken away from other issues in the ports. The question is, is Jolla planning to help in any way in order to have the functionality on ported devices also.
09:08:44 <Thaodan_> I think it comes down to native or hybris port. Hybris ports could just reuse the sailfish-fpd-slave-binder if allowed in theory.
09:08:55 <Thaodan_> If I understand that correctly.
09:09:45 <Jaymzz> So this one is a bit complicated. It has been discussed before and it comes down to us (Jolla) providing enablers for the community to do so (which means quite a significant amount of time and resources put on it) and we currently simply are not able to provide that amount of resource to proceed with this.
09:11:09 <Jaymzz> ApBBB asking: is it possible for someone to work under nda on that??
09:11:39 <dcaliste> Jaymzz, I'm not a porter and have no idea how this is working, but if a porter is motivated, can he access the required bit with an NDA ?
09:12:09 <Thaodan_> Would it be possible to allow the use of the fpd binder slave so that at least ports that are using the trebble interface can have a working fingerprint reader?
09:12:24 <TheKit[m]> > I think it comes down to native or hybris port. Hybris ports could just reuse the sailfish-fpd-slave-binder if allowed in theory.
09:12:24 <TheKit[m]> It may not work verbatim (tested on Fxtec)
09:12:42 <TheKit[m]> debugging without source code of at least that part is hard
09:12:50 <Jaymzz> That was in consideration, (the NDA I mean) but then there were logistical and legal issues regarding the distribution of the SW later on. That has stalled the NDA idea for now. Can't gointo more details unfortunately :(
09:13:24 <Thaodan_> Thats true but there a Sony ports that are nearly identical to Jollas ports and just need the binary.
09:14:16 <Jaymzz> FYI 3 min left on this one
09:14:18 <Thaodan_> I've heard the slave just resuses trebble interfaces and isn't that large.
09:14:57 <Jaymzz> A comment from ApBBB: it seems like the politics inside jolla are becoming more and more complex and this puts obstacles in moving SFOS forward. We -as a community- need a way to help. So help us help you
09:16:53 <Jaymzz> The insider politics inside Jolla have not changed much, they just apply to different things at different times which may look like they change. Because we have big paying customers, we have to be extremely careful with what we do. Nevertheless, these meetings are for us to see what the community wants and needs, so that we can do our best to provide it
09:17:45 <Jaymzz> The fact that you mention this topic here means that it will internally be discussed and potentially there can be solutions we can provide in the near future. That is when we see the willingness from you guys :)
09:18:01 <flypig> If the NDA route was available, would there be takers?
09:18:41 <Thaodan_> I think I would be willing to do that. But I think we need multiple people I think.
09:19:21 <flypig> Okay, that's a good positive start though.
09:19:36 <Jaymzz> #info if the NDA route were to be available, there are takers for the task.
09:19:54 <Jaymzz> ApBBB to flypig: answer to flypig. rinigus is working on the tama devices and if he cant get it from jolla he said he might need to write it from scratch.
09:21:10 <Jaymzz> This has gone over time. I need to move it on
09:21:24 <Jaymzz> #topic Allowing more apis/functionality in the official store (2020 edition) (10 min – asked by ApBBB)
09:21:38 <Jaymzz> #info Its a long standing -and annoying i will add- issue that jolla doesn't allow certain apis in the store. This means that we are missing great native apps (ie. mapping) and functionality for stuff that jolla doesn't provide (ie text prediction in some languages). So are there any -concrete not the usual soon™- plans to fix at least some of these issues.
09:22:14 <Jaymzz> So here is an answer:
09:22:15 <Jaymzz> #info Before we can accept an API in the store, it has to meet certain quality level, with regards to stability and documentation. It takes time to review the APIs. We are currently working on a concrete list of requirements that the API must fulfill. After we have finished that work, the community could help us in the actual review work of individual APIs, so there is hope that the process could be faster in the future.
09:23:16 <Jaymzz> ApBBB asks: any ETA for the requirements going public??
09:23:43 <Jaymzz> I think we have ViGe online here, he may be able to answer that.
09:23:55 <ViGe> too early to say :/
09:24:21 <Mister_Magister> jolla store at the moment is something noone uses. openrepos dominates in every field
09:25:02 <Jaymzz> ApBBB says:  Also there seem to be stuff that are ready, in repos, but in limbo it the pgp email stuff that damien wrote. Info on that would be nice to have.
09:27:31 <dcaliste> ApBBB, technically, it's available in the official repositories. A bit hidden.
09:27:33 <Jaymzz> ApBBB says: other than the requirements are there any apis to be added soon (next  few months for example). we need to end this fragmentation between openrepos and the store.
09:27:50 <Thaodan_> dcaliste: hidden like the webdav support
09:28:09 <Mister_Magister> at this speed fragmentation will never end
09:28:37 <flypig> dcaliste, what's stopping it being 'more' available? I've heard from others the GPG in openrepos is no longer working.
09:29:31 <dcaliste> flypig: some advertising and a clear how to for additional installation I guess.
09:29:49 <dcaliste> Currently, the info is hidden in the comments of this answer : https://together.jolla.com/question/887/gpg-for-email-and-other-stuff/?answer=155818#post-id-155818
09:30:14 <ViGe> ApBBB: We are working on getting some APIs added, but like already mentioned, these things take time (and work). And there is a lot of uncertainty, which is why we are not really willing to promise any specific APIs at this time.
09:30:21 <Thaodan_> Its already outdated so not that "safe" to use.
09:30:35 <dcaliste> Thaodan_, what do you mean about webdav ?
09:31:06 <Mister_Magister> webdav is available from settings, no?
09:31:15 <Thaodan_> dcaliste: the sync plugin for buteo
09:31:31 <Thaodan_> Mister_Magister: no only carddav and caldav
09:31:46 <Thaodan_> which use webdav but no file synbc
09:31:51 <Thaodan_> *sync
09:32:03 <dcaliste> For GnuPG ancient version, yes it's really an issue. I'm going to propose a topic for next meeting about some propositions to officially include GPLv3 current version of GnuPG.
09:32:32 <Thaodan_> That would great, maybe we can use NFC smartcards in the future
09:32:46 <Thaodan_> the next gnupg version will improve rhat.
09:32:48 <flypig> Ah, I was confusing the two issues of GnuPG version and your nice UI. Sorry dcaliste.
09:32:49 <Thaodan_> *that
09:33:10 <Mister_Magister> Thaodan_: ah yess
09:33:40 <dcaliste> flypig : both are an issue at the moment ;) The first for security reason and lack of availability for everyone and the latter for lack of documentation and advertising.
09:34:10 <Jaymzz> I'm giving this a couple more minutes
09:34:12 <flypig> But there's no newer version in the repos right now, is there?
09:34:13 <dcaliste> Thaodan_; is there a buteo plugin for file syncing (webdav) already ?
09:34:30 <ljo> #info For the text prediction (mentioned in issue) I am rewriting the functionality we need from the presage library to be unicode-aware and under lgpl3. The work has progressed well, but in finishing touches and student is adding tests.
09:34:44 <Thaodan_> If I read your code there is dcaliste
09:34:46 <dcaliste> flypig: yes because newer versions are GPLv3 and cannot be included in the corporate version of SFOS.
09:35:14 <Thaodan_> https://git.sailfishos.org/mer-core-contrib/buteo-sync-plugin-webdav
09:35:49 <dcaliste> Thaodan: ah but this never went further than prototype and is missing account identification at the moment ;)
09:36:16 <Thaodan_> you're right but the situation is simila
09:36:20 <Thaodan_> r
09:36:23 <dcaliste> If you are interested, I can work on it again. Particularly, I've a plugin for web calendar and are currently working on adding jolla-setting UI for it.
09:36:58 <dcaliste> So why not reuse this knowledge for the webdav one.
09:37:02 <Thaodan_> That would be great, especially because caldav calendars can expose webcalendars
09:37:43 <dcaliste> Sorry Jaymzz and ApBBB for disgression …
09:37:55 <Thaodan_> Its my fault^^
09:37:59 <Jaymzz> No worries. Let's move on :)
09:38:11 <Jaymzz> #topic general discussion (15 min)
09:38:23 <Jaymzz> You can technically continue the same discussion :P
09:39:48 <Thaodan_> thanks Jaymzz :D
09:41:15 <Jaymzz> Anything to discuss guys? :) Otherwise we can just move on
09:42:01 <Jaymzz> #topic next meeting time and date (5 min)
09:42:04 <Thaodan_> Anyone interrested in Android 10 based ports?
09:42:06 <dcaliste> Jaymzz, about the GPG for email, do you think you will be allowed to make the blog post out ?
09:42:10 <Thaodan_> ah than new topic
09:42:19 <Jaymzz> #info Next meeting will be held on Jan 23rd 2020 at 09:00 UTC
09:42:31 <Jaymzz> Thaodan_: Sorry what? :D
09:43:05 <Thaodan_> Jaymzz: Android 10 based SailfishOS port
09:43:40 <Jaymzz> I haven't seen such topic, is it on the planning page?
09:43:59 <Thaodan_> There are some efforts but its a huge tasks
09:44:04 <Thaodan_> *task
09:44:46 <Jaymzz> yeah
09:45:22 <Jaymzz> Anyway
09:45:38 <Jaymzz> Let's end the meeting as we are running out of time :)
09:45:54 <Jaymzz> Thanks all for attending!
09:45:58 <Thaodan_> Will there be a meeting at FOSDEM this year?
09:46:53 <Jaymzz> Thaodan_: I doubt it at this moment... There is a chance that none of the sailors will have the time to make it. But we are trying to figure something out. If not, we'll arrange something with the community. Maybe Thaodan_ you can help out as always ;)
09:47:32 <Jaymzz> I'm ending the meeting :)
09:47:36 <Jaymzz> #endmeeting