Tuesday, 2011-12-13

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iekkumorning04:32
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Sagemorning05:26
befordhello05:27
* Sage is unable to select word wrap in libreoffice draw05:27
Sagethere is option "Word wrap text in shape" but it is inactive :/05:27
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Sagehttp://sage.kapsi.fi/Mer/misc/Nemomobile-OBS-project-structure-draft.png06:23
Sagefirst draft06:23
Sageveskuh, w00t, Stskeeps, et al. ^06:34
StskeepsSage: http://www.linuxfordevices.com/images/stories/samsung_bada_arch.jpg comes to mind06:34
Sage\o/ manged to get the text wrap :D06:35
Sagea bit hackish way but I don't care atm :)06:36
Sagebtw, feedback and comments welcome.06:38
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SageUpdated the obs project structure image.07:19
Stskeepsbetter07:19
SageI would have liked to separate the MW, UX and Apps projects a bit as well but not sure yet how that could be put.07:21
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niqtmorning07:38
veskuhSage looks nice07:41
marquizSage: yesterday i tested ofono on n950 a bit07:45
marquizi guess  you read the comment07:45
marquizbut anyway, the problem (with gprs) seems to be that connman doesn't configure the interface07:45
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Sagemarquiz: well we had a patch to that in old connman but the upstream mainer claimed it is now fixed.08:01
SageMight be that we need the fix by jpeltonen in again.08:01
marquizSage: k08:02
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veskuhin which project dialer is?08:57
veskuhis project:MTF:Tracker the only place?08:58
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xruxaSage: http://sage.kapsi.fi/Mer/misc/Nemomobile-OBS-project-structure-draft.png wondering how can one have apps under framework under common components ... is it all upside down?09:09
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Sagexruxa: well, couldn't decide how to do the picture Mer Core up or down :P09:10
SageAnyway should be remembered that it is OBS project graph not architecture graph. In architecture Adapations would be other side of Mer core.09:10
Sagenothing prevents me drawing it like that though...09:11
xruxaOfftopic - if I install Ubuntu 11.04 parallel to 11.10 to share same home partition, will it blow up in my face?09:15
w00tif in doubt, always take backups09:15
Stskeepsxruxa: gnome settings and such maybe..09:16
xruxaI just really hate 11.1009:16
Stskeepswe should really make a proper mer netbook ui09:16
Stskeeps:P09:16
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w00tfocus.. :P09:20
Stskeepssorry09:23
Stskeeps:P09:23
iekku11.10 </309:31
Stskeepswhat is your perception on when the meeting is? 1h30m from now?09:31
iekkuwife updated it and since that i have only heard bad things about ubuntu09:32
* xruxa hates 11.10. Pulling 11.04 ISO09:33
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* Sage should update to fedora 16 ;)09:38
Sagewith xfce probably as the gnome 3 isn't really usable.09:39
w00tSage: f16's gnome 3 isn't that bad09:39
w00t(imo)09:39
w00tonly one day's worth of use so far, but still09:39
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Sagew00t: well all I need from the UX is, alt+tab, alt+f2 and some indicators (wifi, bt, date, time) and working dual monitor.09:54
Sageon my f15 I'm currently calling "xrandr --output HDMI1 --above eDP1" to get monitors aligned as I like.09:54
Sagethe SG meeting is in 1hour 5min?09:55
Stskeepsyeah, let's say it is so?09:57
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the-bossphaeron lbt sage stskeeps SR#3571 waiting for review at https://build.pub.meego.com//request/show/357110:19
dcthangwell, any idea if N950's camera broken with the newest package?10:30
Stskeepshmm10:34
Stskeepsi wonder if we could put PhoneGap on top of Nemo10:34
dcthangPhoneGap? why?10:35
Stskeepsbecause it's less vaporware than tizen?10:35
Stskeepsand OSS10:35
* dm8tbr liked the comment from the MIC mail 'because it could take long before we see it' or sthg like that10:35
dcthangok, reasonable for that10:35
mikhasStskeeps, would there be good reasons against it?10:36
Stskeepsmikhas: i'm having difficulties finding any10:36
mikhasPhoneGap seems to have a decent community10:36
dcthangPhonegap is acquired by adobe10:37
Stskeepshttp://wiki.phonegap.com/w/page/16494811/PhoneGap-Symbian-%28Qt%29 is interesting too10:37
Stskeepsdcthang: yeah, but a apache foundation project10:37
mikhasdcthang, that means someone is willing to make it as polished as Flash10:37
mikhasthat is, it's a good sign, in my book10:37
Stskeepshttps://build.phonegap.com/10:51
Stskeepsheh, nice10:51
StskeepsANNOUNCE: Nemo Mobile steering group meeting in 8 minutes in #mer-meeting10:53
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the-bossphaeron lbt sage stskeeps SR#3571 Accepted promotion request11:08
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tbfSage: regarding the many dependencies of tracker... they are needed by the file system miner11:44
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tbfSage: ideally all apps would update their meta data themself...11:45
tbfso you'd only need miners when adding files from outside11:45
tbfSage: but even there i'd agree that the native apps shall do the indexing, instead of some crazy fs miner11:45
tbfrationale: fewer system dependencies, consistent experience, and not worth to produce meta data you cannot process with any apps11:46
tbfSage: so yes, tracker-fs-miner must die11:47
tbffrom my pv11:47
tbfpov11:47
w00tnow we just need to convince tracker!11:48
tbfw00t: afaik they'd love getting rid of the miner11:49
Sage:D11:49
tbfw00t: it's just their today's solution for a horribly broken world11:49
tbfso actually with nemo there'd be the chance to try meta data the pure way11:50
mikhasyou should get ivan here11:50
tbfhe'll tell the same :-)11:51
tbfSage: w00t: so probably for adding tracker to nemo, i'd probably really start by packaging without tracker-fs-miner at all11:52
tbf→ dependency hell solved11:52
tbf→ tracker-sucking-battery-in-background problem also gone away11:52
tbfproblem: meta data search won't work11:53
tbfso in a next step, apps would have to be updated to put meta data into tracker11:53
Sagemain things using tracker are sms, dialer, people etc.11:54
tbfguess they don't want to deal with RDF directly, so for common use-cases a small framework would be needed11:54
tbfSage: you can do so much more11:54
tbfSage: imagine the email app writes meta data...11:54
mikhasbrowser11:54
tbfand your notes app11:54
mikhasmedia player11:54
tbfmedia player - prime example11:54
tbfcalendar11:55
Sagewe don't have all of those in Nemo :)11:55
mikhasyou will have11:55
Stskeepsif anyone contributes them11:55
mikhas=> need to plan for that future already, or it will never happen11:55
Stskeeps:P11:55
Sagenot atm. so I don't see those as a problem as we need to write the apps first :)11:55
mikhasno, writing apps first, tracker agnostic, does NOT work11:55
Sagemikhas: ??11:55
mikhasthe semantic store (+ framework to use it) needs to exist11:56
mikhasotherwise, apps start using their own db solution11:56
mikhas=> you need miners to get their data11:56
tbfideally also on top of sqlite...11:56
tbf...with a db schema similar to the normalized schema in tracker :-D11:56
w00tare either of you volunteering to work on any of this? because otherwise, it'll probably be left to Sage11:56
w00t:P11:56
w00tthe best way to make something happen, etc...11:57
Sagemikhas: If you do the work I'm all for it :)11:57
tbfdarn! :-)11:57
tbfare they mockups?11:57
Sagewe don't have notes or calendar at all11:58
Sagewe have video player but that would need total rewrite probably anyway11:58
tbfdamn... need a mer friendly device for hacking :-D11:58
veskuhSage: yep, videoplayer is useless11:58
Stskeepstbf: no N900?11:58
SageI can agree with dropping the miner from tracker. And I can do that probably.11:58
tbfStskeeps: its usb port is dead11:59
Stskeepstbf: and i presume you don't have a jig11:59
tbfStskeeps: not anymore11:59
tbfStskeeps: also flashing sucks without usb ;-)11:59
Sagemikhas: I meant that I agree having tracker as storage after dropping the miner. And I meant taht we can already drop fs as we con't have any apps using that I think.11:59
Stskeepstbf: uboot11:59
tbfshould finally find one with soldering skills to fix the port for me12:00
Stskeepstbf: got a exopc?12:00
Stskeepsor similar12:00
tbfguess can get some12:01
tbfoh. exopc12:01
Stskeepswe can run nemo on X86 too12:01
w00tor lenovo12:01
Stskeepsand soon in LLVMpipe/virtual machines too12:01
tbfnot "epoxy"12:01
tbfw00t: such a device i have...12:02
tbfw00t: and actually i'd very much would love making use of it12:02
* w00t nods12:02
w00tgot nemo on mine too :P12:02
Sagenemo runs quite nicely on lenovo ideapad12:02
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veskuhbtw; is there any install instructions needed for x86 image? I'd like to see them in wiki if they are needed..12:04
Stskeepsveskuh: write to usb stick, boot..12:05
veskuhStskeeps: yep, I might manage that without instructions :)12:05
w00tit's pretty simple, the same as any other OS12:05
Sageif you want to install to hdd, start terminal, su, run installer-shell12:05
w00tthe install bit is less obvious, but still not that hard12:05
w00t^12:06
niqti shoul try it on my wetab, it's similar lenovo or expopc12:16
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Sageniqt: it works on it. However there is the screen going black issue similar to exopc12:24
niqti write it... i have fault memory12:25
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tbfbig question now: how to get http://repository.maemo.org/meego/Nemo/0.20111128.3.CE.2011-12-01.2/images/nemo-handset-i586-testing/ onto an idea pad?13:08
Stskeepswrite it to a usb stick13:09
Stskeepswin32diskimager13:09
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w00thttp://twitter.com/vivainio/status/14659519562082304214:20
w00txruxa: ^14:20
w00tveskuh: ^ too14:20
veskuhWow14:20
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Stskeepsthis makes me ponder if they managed to get someone from legal drunk at a christmas lunch14:23
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xruxaw00t: ha, good move :)14:26
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xruxajust wondering what "product icons" means ... do not care much for icons, do care for the theme graphics :)14:27
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w00ti imagine it includes pretty much most of the theme, but let's see14:27
veskuhYes, it should cover the graphics also. As the target it be able to make and run harmattan qt apps on other platforms14:39
w00t:)14:40
xruxaCool14:40
w00ti still think it's an odd decision personally, but one i'm happy with14:40
w00t:P14:40
xruxaI think this is decision taken almost year too late14:41
veskuhwell, actually for symbian we already had gfx open sourced14:41
w00tveskuh: yeah, but well.. symbian isn't as pretty14:41
w00t;)14:41
veskuhw00t:  :)14:41
xruxaActually, the Symbian stuff is total Frankenstein of N9 style and somethingweirdandfoundonlyonsymbian14:42
veskuhxruxa: yep, the decission come far too late. Luckily villev had the energy to push it.14:43
xruxaI for one, will love to see new theming (Base) for MTF apps and full theme for Components. This will give us boost.14:44
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faenilthat is a grea news :)14:52
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Sagewow, so harmattan theme is totally open now?15:04
veskuhSage: not yet15:04
Sageveskuh: what is missing then?15:05
veskuhSage: we got legal ok, but apparently there is still some branding people involved and we need to cherry pick the stuff that can be released15:05
Sageah15:05
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faenilfor those of you who're part of Launchpad, Lumia 800 is available as a gift :D15:15
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niqt<fenil> have you received a mail?15:18
faenilin case anyone is interested, of course :D15:18
faenilnope, read some tweets and logged in to check15:18
Stskeepsfaenil: easy xmas gifts..15:18
Stskeeps:P15:18
xruxaI want Lumia for one. Bummer.15:18
faenilStskeeps: :) It's not an R&D N9, but still a very nice phone :D15:18
veskuhfaenil: Not even jealous, I did enough tweaking of autoexec.bat and config.sys already when I was a kid ;)15:19
xruxait has camera button. Game changer for me.15:19
veskuhxruxa: true15:19
veskuhaltough I've heard about pocket-pictures :)15:19
xruxaI regularly disconnect calls with my ear on N9, go figure what went wrong with the proximity sensor15:20
faenilveskuh: don't be cruel :D15:21
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xruxaBTW, if there are still some old N900 I'd like to have one, the solder job I did on mine will not last long15:24
faenil:)15:24
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* Sage is affraid when his N900 breaks :/15:32
Sagewould be nice to have a spare one as I have heard so many horror stories about the usb connector :/15:32
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Sageto bad that jig doesn't have usb connector so that doesn't reduce the usb usage :/15:34
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faenildid I lose the meeting? has it already been done?15:36
Sageyes, meeting was almost 5 hours ago15:38
faenilok, let's read the log :)15:38
SageStskeeps: we really need a page for #mer-meeting that contains the meeting times :)15:38
Stskeepsyes15:39
Sagewith links to some website that shows the time on everytimezone15:39
xruxawas it mer-meeting or nemo-meeting?15:39
faenilit's written on the wiki :) 11 utc, 13est15:39
Stskeepsxruxa: mer15:40
* xruxa was it the wrong place, and was not alone. Should have noticed the meeting bot was not there :(15:40
SageYou won't get lost if you ask around ;)15:41
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faenilbrb guys :) cya later15:56
faeniloh one thing first, none in #harmattan was able to help with :)15:56
faenilI have plugged my N9 to my linux laptop via USB15:57
faenilcopied all files over from DCIM folder, and then deleted all files in that folder on the N915:57
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