Friday, 2013-02-22

the-bossphaeron lbt sage stskeeps SR#8177 waiting for review at https://build.pub.meego.com//request/show/817700:00
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faenilthp, keep going :)00:23
faenilit*00:24
thplast PRs for today: https://github.com/nemomobile/lipstick-colorful-home/pull/11 and https://github.com/nemomobile/qmlmusicplayer/pull/100:31
thpgoodnight :)00:32
faenil:)00:32
faenilgn to you thp00:32
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w00tthp: nice work00:33
M4rtinKnice ! :)00:34
M4rtinKanyway, good night :)00:34
faenilgood night from myself too :)00:35
faenilw00t, get some rest! :P00:35
* w00t will still be up a few more hours probably00:35
faenilI know you'll be here already when I wake up :D00:36
faenilwell...good luck with what you have to stay up late for :)00:36
* lpotter will be up for a few hours more too00:36
faenilthis is like teasing guys :P00:37
faenilanyway, good night :) hope you will get your deserved rest :) sooner or later00:37
* lpotter gets more coffee00:38
Aardfaenil: I'm staying up a bit longer as well :p00:39
w00tlpotter: you don't count, you're australian :P00:39
Aardw00t: I thought you too?00:39
faenilhaahah00:39
w00tAard: .. and also in australia :(00:40
Aardw00t: lame excuses00:40
faenilxD00:40
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chriadamhehe00:40
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w00tyou know, a dell u3011 and a compiling macbook is more than enough to heat this office quite well00:49
w00tspecial: ^ survival guide to norway00:49
lpotterheck, just running flash in Safari is enough to heat up a small room00:54
Aardw00t: at least here in finland it's almost t-shirt weather00:57
lpotteralmost t-shirt wether here too... put on a t-shirt, that is00:59
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w00tAard: yeah, it's warmed up here the past days01:04
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the-bossphaeron lbt sage stskeeps SR#8179 waiting for review at https://build.pub.meego.com//request/show/817901:36
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juicememorning05:50
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iekkumorning06:08
dm8tbrmoaning06:10
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situMorning06:44
plundstrsage: for SR 8171. I didn't see any need for themedaemon. maliit worked nicely without it06:51
specialugh, not sure if that message went through..06:53
specialplundstr: if the keyboard loads qt-components et al, those will wait up to 3 seconds for a themedaemon connection before falling back06:54
special(of course, right now mthemedaemon.service doesn't actually guarantee that the themedaemon is ready, but that's another problem..)06:55
plundstrspecial:  Are you saying that we should start also mthemedaemon for devicelock?06:56
mikhaswait what? mthemedaemon is still not dead?!07:01
plundstrI don't know if it does anything (can't see the difference with and without) but at least it is running.07:02
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mikhasthe idea of a theme daemon is to cache graphical assets and share them between applications07:04
mikhashowever, the way mthemedaemon does it is completely braindead, IMO07:05
mikhas(what you need to optimize is what gets loaded onto the GPU)07:05
specialplundstr: I don't know. Possibly.07:05
specialmikhas: what's braindead about it?07:05
specialplundstr: there will be warnings printed if it's waiting on the theme daemon or if it falls back to the local theme provider07:07
mikhasspecial, it requires applications to use special macros and that non-working, sometimes very slow MScalableImage07:07
mikhasspecial, I think you could do all the caching transparently, within the graphics engine for instance07:08
specialmikhas: it's changed since the meegotouch days07:08
specialmikhas: it's all hidden behind the theme provider for QML07:08
specialqt-components implements a provider to allow the use of things like.. source: "image://theme/icon-l-quack"07:09
specialthat will look up icon-l-quack in the theme, using mthemedaemon and all of its benefits if available07:09
mikhasspecial, file-based caching is something the kernel should already do for you07:10
specialmikhas: it's not file-based, the images are decoded and shared between processes.. X pixmaps, possibly? I forget the details07:10
mikhasXPixmaps? Ugh … that means roundtrips07:11
specialit shares memory, saves the decoding time and the theme lookup time07:11
mikhasDo you have benchmarks *proving* the claimed benefits of mthemedaemon?07:11
specialyes07:11
mikhasAnd have you checked whether you could possibly recreate those benefits in a much much simpler way?07:11
specialwhen w00t and I enabled it 4 or 5 months ago we benchmarked, it was around 400ms off startup time for qt-components applications07:11
specialsuch as?07:12
mikhasTo be fair, I havent checked whether you ripped out parts/cleaned up mthemedaemon already.07:12
specialit's untouched other than removing the meegotouch dependency, I believe07:12
mikhasspecial, instead of having many small icons/assets, have a sprite map for instance07:13
mikhasoriginally, MeeGo Touch was designed to come with a SVG-based theming engine …07:13
specialthat might make mthemedaemon's performance better, but it wouldn't solve any of the problems mthemedaemon is meant to solve07:13
mikhasonly that SVG parsing was slow with Qt07:13
specialPNG decoding on ARM is *slow*. The filesystem search is slow, thanks to braindead theme directory layouts07:14
mikhasbingo07:14
specialand without some daemon involved those will be done separately for every application every time07:14
mikhasbut you wouldn't have to use PNGs in the first place07:14
mikhascould all be vector graphics07:14
specialI don't understand? Vector graphics would be nice, but that makes performance issues even worse.07:15
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plundstrspecial: I can see the warning, "WARNING: RemoteThemeDaemonClient: Failed to connect to theme server" but even if I add back the old line "Requires=mthemedaemon.service" to maliit, that warning won't go away. So my change to maliit oes nothing new.07:16
specialplundstr: yeah, that's what I meant. We should really get the signalling to systemd set up from mthemedaemon (and mapplauncherd)07:17
plundstrspecial: I can add those at some point, should have a bug as remainder07:18
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specialplundstr: email for CC?07:24
plundstrspecial: pekka.lundstrom@jollamobile.com07:24
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specialdone07:27
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plundstrthanks07:28
mikhasah, it's you Pekka! the guy who helped me with upstart back then ;-)07:30
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plundstrHi Michael, yes same old me. Boot is hunting me no matter where I go ;)07:36
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mikhasthat's why one should only write "loves making cupcakes" on a CV, otherwise you get employed for what you have been doing for years07:39
mikhas;-)07:40
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the-bossphaeron lbt sage stskeeps SR#8171 Rejected promotion request08:23
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the-bossphaeron lbt sage stskeeps SR#8181 waiting for review at https://build.pub.meego.com//request/show/818109:05
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the-bossphaeron lbt sage stskeeps SR#8182 waiting for review at https://build.pub.meego.com//request/show/818209:06
the-bossphaeron lbt sage stskeeps SR#8183 waiting for review at https://build.pub.meego.com//request/show/818309:07
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sledgesthp, do you like social sites? (diaspora/g+/fb) ? :)09:57
thpsledges: i'm on g+ if you mean that. not using it regularly.10:00
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thpand twitter, obviously10:01
rcgbtw is there a (good) g+ client for nemo or harmattan?10:01
sledgesthe next big effort on Nemo/Sailfish will be social app10:01
sledgesmw is being done already by chriadam|away and Sfiet_Konstantin10:01
sledgesUX is begging to be made10:02
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sledgesthe one and only hurdle is - we need info if Jolla is making the UI, to avoid double effort10:02
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phakorcg, apart from the "no api, no app" problem...10:02
thprcg: crochik's gapp?10:02
Stskeepssledges: my general opinion is never to rely on a single person or company's plans10:03
Stskeepssledges: that showed quite well in meego10:04
sledgesso you recommend to just go with it and write social UI for Nemo10:04
sledgesopensource it, and whoever wants, they can enjoy the benefits of10:04
sledgessuch open effort (a relatively big one), needs a steering group/community around it I believe10:05
thpinstead of writing stuff from scratch all the time, what about using a proven social app and just putting a mobile ui on top?10:05
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sledgesFB has been written many times, using many different approaches (I know at least 3 fb apps for/ported to nemo)10:06
sledgesbut the traction is around QML these days, because there has been no decency around social fb app in qml terms10:06
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sledges(withe exception of Nokia FB Client harmattan app)10:07
rcgwell, my hope was that there is already a harmattan app that can be easily ported/packaged for nemo10:07
sledges(closed src..)10:07
sledges^ rcg :)10:07
rcge.g., kasvopus and twimgo are great :)10:07
sledgescurrent MW effort (in nemo-qml-plugins social) is to unify the API of multiple social sites, so one could have a unified news feed to say the least)10:08
rcgsounds nice10:09
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sledgeswe need a discussion on ml about the vision/design/reuse-possibilities10:11
sledgesI think Sfiet_Konstantin could draw a picture from how existing mw will look like and what ux can fit on top10:12
sledgesand if ppl are comfortable with 'one social app to rule them all' idea10:13
sledgesand/or should microblogging sites be separated from that lot10:13
Sfiet_Konstantinmw ?10:13
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: currently, we are focusing on facebook10:13
Sfiet_Konstantinmaybe other social network will come one day10:13
sledgesso is it extensible/pluggable ?10:14
Sfiet_Konstantinit is10:16
sledgesit's good you're taking one step at a time then :)10:18
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the-bossphaeron lbt sage stskeeps SR#8184 waiting for review at https://build.pub.meego.com//request/show/818410:31
rcg:)10:33
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faenilmorning guys! o/10:40
rcgmornin faenil10:45
faenilo/10:45
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faenilpeople asking whether kernel 3.9 (which brings ARM optimizations) will help with harmattan10:52
Stskeepsno10:52
Stskeeps:P10:52
faenil:D10:52
faenilwill it help nemo? :P10:52
Stskeepsnot really no10:52
faeniljk :P10:53
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faenilThis uni project I'm working on is about texture packing, but I should definitely reuse code for a Tetris CPU AI.....11:01
faenilit's basically the same thing! XD11:01
faenilthp, ping11:04
thpfaenil: tetris cpu ai?11:07
faenilthp, yeah AI for the tetris game11:07
faenilessentially the texture packing algo I'm building is the same thing11:08
faenilplays a tetris game with textures :D11:08
faenilthp, anyway, I was wondering, how would you feel about organizing a Nemo "contributaton" :D11:10
faenilI've always wanted to have an event like that...but I first wanted to ask you as you have more experience with this kind of events11:11
fk_lxfaenil: it would be good if someone else would organize it, who doesn't exclude people for no reason, someone neutral11:12
faenilfk_lx, I don't see why one would exclude people :)11:12
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fk_lxfaenil: and I see, there a lot more people in Nemo community who would be more suitable for this11:13
faeniloh come on guys :) peace and love11:14
rcgfaenil, +1 :)11:16
faenilso, if thp or anyone else has any valuable input on this, I'd like to keep this going :)11:19
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fk_lxfaenil: such nemo hackathon could happen almost anywhere, but it is for sure better if there is a place where you can find cheap accomodation to minimize the costs. You can also do parallel hackathons, like it is with Python Bug Day, so people gather in more than one location (but each location includes some more experienced people to help those less experienced)11:54
fk_lxgreat idea could be some kind of camping area with good internet connection and easy to reach by transport11:58
fk_lxpublic transport11:58
* w00t yawns11:59
* iekku too11:59
fk_lx:-)12:00
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azadpakiHi every one12:07
iekkuahoy12:07
azadpakiI installed nemo on n900 and wana discuss some issues12:08
fk_lxazdapaki: feel free12:08
iekkudid you install it to memory card, if you did, which one?12:09
faenilfk_lx, thinking about a place in Pisa...12:09
azadpakiI installed it on memory card12:09
azadpakievery thing is fine\12:09
fk_lxfaenil: really nice place and cheap airlines are operating to Pisa12:09
azadpakibut scrolling in "setting" not functioning\12:10
fk_lxfk_lx: do you know any pleace that could be used for free, like university, library etc.12:10
faenilfk_lx, I'm thinking...12:11
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azadpakiI thing it is a bug in nemo mobile image N900 that scrolling is not functioning in Mobile Settings12:12
iekkuazadpaki, https://bugs.nemomobile.org/show_bug.cgi?id=573 ?12:12
MerbotNemo bug 573 in Settings/ControlPanel "No scrolling in ControlPanel" [Normal,New]12:12
faenilholy crap that's a huge problem xD12:12
azadpakithanks\12:12
azadpakiproblem 2. Volume bar is also not functioning12:13
faenilthat's also known I guess12:14
faenildon't know if the stuff thp commited today fixes that12:14
azadpakiNemo is getting better but need some basic things first12:15
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azadpakiUX is fine but in N900 no close button so I have to open keyboard to close through long process12:17
thpazadpaki: swipe from edge not working?12:18
fk_lxthp: only working with pencil12:19
fk_lxI mean plastic pen12:19
iekkui think n900 isn't so much supported anymore, more fixes coming to n9 and n95012:19
azadpakiswipe from corner also not working12:19
fk_lxazdapaki: it works with finger but is really hard to acheive12:19
fk_lxazdapaki: try with pen12:20
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w00tsomeone needs to make the gestures plugin threshold configurable12:23
w00tthere's a todo in the code for it, but it hasn't ever happened12:23
w00ton the n900, you'd want a larger value12:23
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w00ti'm happy to help someone do it, but as i don't have an n900, i have no motivation to do it myself12:26
w00tso.. any takers?12:26
fk_lxw00t: I could if you'd help, have N900 with Nemo12:28
w00tok, so the repository you'll want is at https://github.com/nemomobile/mcompositor-gestures12:29
w00thttps://github.com/nemomobile/mcompositor-gestures/blob/master/src/mswitchergesture.cpp#L202 that is what you'll want to change12:29
fk_lxok, will have a look12:30
iekku:)12:31
w00tI'd suggest using qgetenv to try look for an environment variable and fall back to the default (10) if it isn't set or is invalid, and then look at exporting the right environment variable in the n900 specific device configuration12:31
w00tSage: can help you with where that is12:32
norayrw00t: you did not move that repo, right? https://gitorious.org/meego-developer-edition-for-n900/meegotouch-community-l10n12:34
norayrjust to make sure12:34
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w00tnorayr: no, I've been a bit busy the past few days12:35
w00tI'll look at it today12:35
w00tsorry for the delay12:35
norayrno problem12:36
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sledgesw00t, I haven't got the non-gradient icon. hope it's vectory13:53
sledgesw00t, to your 2nd comment: Vesuri hardcoded the resolution numbers into the graphic file name, we should agree on consensus13:53
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sledgesVesuri: https://github.com/nemomobile/nemo-theme-default/pull/1#issuecomment-1394404813:54
w00tsledges: well, we can just change it ;)13:54
w00tthere isn't a graphic, so there's no problem changing it13:54
w00tI'll find a link to the SVG, one moment13:55
sledgesthat could go to Mer/Artwork repo too ;)13:55
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Vesurisledges: I did tell you it can be changed14:07
Vesuri(04:22:57 PM) Vesuri: sledges: yeah, it might be more flexible if the asset name wouldn't mention the size and then there could be different asset (theme) packages for different devices14:08
Vesuri(04:30:39 PM) Vesuri: sure, it's also possible to have one image that's suitable for all devices, either centered or stretched to fit14:08
Vesuri(04:30:46 PM) Vesuri: and rotated if necessary14:08
Vesuri(04:31:01 PM) Vesuri: the shutdown screen qml is in lipstick-colorful-home14:08
Vesuriso... please choose a suitable alternative, keeping in mind that the device resolution and orientation may differ14:08
Vesuriimho the most flexible solution would be one that doesn't use a fullscreen image but something that can be centered on the screen on any reasonably sized screen and rotated as necessary14:09
sledgesok, I'm happy everyone's aware about the change (in this way we'd avoid surprises during the demo moments)14:09
Vesurithat would mean a solid color background (any color) and an image that can be nicely placed in the middle14:10
Vesuriexample from the past: the Harmattan shutdown screen is a black screen with a nokia logo in the middle - the image is not a full screen image, but just the nokia logo which is then placed in the middle of a black screen14:11
sledgessoudns enchanting and easy, pity we're then walled by "powered by mer" bit at the bottom corner -- that kind of freedom14:12
Vesurisledges: you can have multiple images as well and just anchor one of them to the bottom edge of the screen14:12
Vesurilike shutdown-logo anchored to middle, shutdown-disclaimer anchored to bottom right...14:13
sledgesI like the disclaimer naming ;) so things become identifiable, yet not overcomplicated14:14
sledgesI'm off to Berlin now, will put the images together Tuesday14:20
sledgesnow time for good karate grading :)14:20
sledgescyas!14:20
mikhassledges, could meet for beer if you come to Berlin14:24
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kontioSage: can you please comment on https://bugs.nemomobile.org/show_bug.cgi?id=537#c4 ? a test case is failing due to missing gstreamer plugins, can we add these plugins, or should we patch tracker to not test these file types?15:22
MerbotNemo bug 537 in .Other "tracker-tests: 11 test cases fail" [Major,Assigned]15:22
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