Thursday, 2013-07-18

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rikanee~seen Venemo_N907:29
rikaneeVenemo_N9: pong07:29
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sledges!seen Venemo_N909:16
Merbotsledges: Venemo_N9 was last seen in #nemomobile 14 hours, 22 minutes, and 29 seconds ago: <Venemo_N9> rikanee, ping09:16
Netweaver_lbt: ping09:17
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Venemo_N9hey sledges what's up?09:45
sledgeshelping rikanee out ;)09:46
faenilsee...I had to ask a neighbour to give me his wifi09:46
rikaneeohai Venemo_N909:46
faenilmorning guys09:46
sledgesI read "wife" :DDD09:46
sledgeshi faenil09:46
sledgesdot is a part of graphviz package09:47
sledgesforgot to break that :)09:47
faenilyeah seen that09:47
sledgesoke :)09:47
faenilthough I was thinking I'm not sure I need that graph09:47
faenilit's a services graph09:47
sledgesservices dependency - shows what starts first in order to satisfy others so they can start in turn09:47
faenilI just need to get rid of qt4 dependent packages and replace x11 with wayland at boot09:47
sledgessystemd is all about parallelising, so boot time [in theory] should be faster! :D09:47
Sfiet_Konstantinhello guys09:48
sledgeshave you checked this:
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges, faenil09:48
sledgesSfiet_Konstantin, hi Sfiet_Konstantin :)09:48
faenilSfiet_Konstantin, o/09:48
Sfiet_Konstantinsledges: yep, sounds promising, but do not seems to be stable yet09:49
faenilsledges, of course..but that's just to test it09:49
Venemo_N9hey rikanee, are you Hurrian?09:49
faenilsledges, I'm making a wayland-only image09:49
rikaneeVenemo_N9: in the flesh, and in disguise ;)09:49
sledgesroger that faenil ;) good work!-09:49
faenilsledges, eh, thanks :P09:49
sledges(buon lavoro :))09:49
rikaneejust cross-check my twitter account with the name on the CA winners page to confirm.09:49
sledgesrikanee, didn't manage to find you on twitter when announcing glacier to the world ;)09:50
rikaneesledges: set up my twitter /after/ releasing Glacier.09:50
Venemo_N9rikanee, I sent you a pm09:50
rikaneeapparently, it's a popular thing to tweet @ uni.09:51
rikaneesledges: @imblying09:51
sledgesbrilliant, you're on #ff tomorrow lol09:53
sledgesso we're all ears on how glacier is doing :)09:53
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rikaneesledges: a bit busy with a totally BS research assignment, although I've been mocking up some of the defaults apps in my free time.09:53
rikaneeno time to finish the rest of the row yet, but the Clock app's… clock looks like the new Clock icon ;)09:54
sledgessmoooth ;)09:54
faenilwe can start with QQC once I'm done with this wayland image09:54
faeniland once QQC are done, we can start rebuidling apps UIs09:54
rikaneewith enough luck I'll finish mocking up Contacts, Calc, etc. on Friday.09:54
faenilno problems we have time09:55
sledgesso you are now doing app-by-app basis, not tha navigation itself (i.e. new Lipstick QML home) yet09:55
faenillots of time, before we get into remaking UIs :D09:55
sledgesthere's always something to be done :) but a great feeling that separate things can be done in parallel 8)09:55
rikaneesledges: I'd like to have all the details ironed out first before laying out the first QML ;)09:57
faenilsledges, is there a way to tell yaml not to install some packages?09:57
faenilI could start from @Nemo X86 VM09:57
faeniland tell it to not install some packages :D09:57
sledgesrikanee, understood, mockup time it is then ;)09:58
sledges@... is pattern09:59
sledges.yaml is top-level package instructions09:59
* sledges confused :}09:59
faenilsledges, I need most of the packages from @Nemo X86 VM09:59
faenilbut not all...I  need to replace some..09:59
faenilbut I can't modify the pattern...09:59
faenilthe alternative is to get rid of @10:00
sledgesah, well quick and dirty is to replace them brutally10:00
faeniland write all the 500+ packages in the yaml10:00
sledgesyup :)10:00
faenileh lol :D10:00
sledgesoh no 500+ :D10:00
Sfiet_Konstantinuse -package10:00
Sfiet_Konstantinto remove one package10:00
sledgesyes, about to say that :D10:00
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faenilSfiet_Konstantin, love you, that's what I meant ;P10:00
sledges(though has nothing to do with yaml :)10:00
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faenilisn't it in the yaml file?10:00
Sfiet_Konstantinks maybe ?10:00
sledgesis in .ks10:00
faenilohhhh sorry, yeah I've been thinking ks and saying yaml XD10:01
faenilsorry guys :D10:01
Sfiet_Konstantinwe understand what you mean :)10:01
faenilyou should see me, I'm in a public park, on a bench, making wayland images, lol10:01
Stskeepsi've solved toolchain issues on a n810 at a music festival10:02
faenilthe only place I could find where there was a "neighbour" gently giving me his wifi :D10:02
* faenil highfives Stskeeps 10:02
iekkufaenil, is there night weather?10:02
iekkuStskeeps, roskilde?10:02
faeniliekku, what do you mean?10:02
* iekku needs 10l of coffee10:02
faenilI'm not in Japan, it's noon here :D10:02
rikaneeP.S.: it seems power management on the N9/50 under Nemo isn't as bad a situation as the one on N900.10:02
* faenil takes martini from Stskeeps and gives it iekku 10:03
faenilrikanee, really? good :D10:03
rikaneeso given that some rough edges be ironed out (and Glacier hides the HW adaptation's rough edges), it should be okay as a daily driver.10:03
faenilrikanee, not too fast :D10:03
iekkufaenil, what? you want me to fall asleep?10:03
faeniliekku, yeah :)10:04
Sfiet_Konstantinglacier is not here yet10:04
rikaneefaenil: baby steps ;)10:04
Sfiet_Konstantinwould love to have moaaar design rules from the designers before hacking10:04
faenilactually my opinions is I'd like to some revolution around nemo10:04
faenilnot just new UI, but new paradigms10:04
Sfiet_Konstantinfaenil: like ?10:04
faenilI mean, Nemo is our playfield, we should be experimenting10:05
faenilnot just trying to reproduce an OS which is similar to other :D10:05
faenilI don't know....just change everything10:05
Sfiet_Konstantinfaenil: I would say: experiment, given the ui design language we have10:05
faenilinnovate on the's not easy10:05
Sfiet_Konstantindon't want to have something like a total mess (like the current nemo)10:05
Stskeepsstart out with components set and a components gallery10:05
Sfiet_Konstantinor have two ui branches10:06
Sfiet_KonstantinStskeeps: yep, a component gallery is nice10:06
faenilStskeeps, start with wayland image xD10:06
rikaneefaenil: re innovation: I'm just mixing it together, really.10:06
faenilrikanee, yeah no offence meant...10:06
rikaneeand hmm, yeah, a Glacier Qt Components app would be nice10:06
faenilgetting rid of those awful Qt Components would already be great10:06
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Sfiet_Konstantinfaenil: they are not aweful10:07
faenilSfiet_Konstantin, they make me vomit! XD10:07
rikaneethey're… a bit dated, but they work.10:07
faenilI hate them, with all my heart10:07
xavinuxHi people :)10:07
rikaneesome of the images are lazy, though.10:07
faenilyeah I'm not talking about features10:07
faenilI'm talking about the graphics styling10:07
rikaneeone of them has a flipped backwards arrow.10:07
faenilxavinux, o/10:07
xavinuxfaenil: hi :)10:08
rikaneeisn't it a carry-over from the MeeGo days, with some images altered to match Blanco?10:08
faenilalright I'll shut up and get back to my job so we can start building QtQuickControls asap10:08
faenilrikanee, yes10:08
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Sfiet_Konstantinfaenil: if you can share the ks when ready, I would be super happy :)10:08
Sfiet_Konstantinor even better: wiki page10:08
faenilSfiet_Konstantin, of course, wiki page is a must10:09
faenilSfiet_Konstantin, I've been having real connection issues at home10:11
faenilso I have lots of spare time these days10:11
faenilbut I'm blocked by that at times10:11
faenilkeeps disconnecting every 30secs10:11
faenilthat's why I'm in the park right now :D10:11
Sfiet_Konstantinwell, you profit from both the weather and free time10:12
Sfiet_Konstantinso :)10:12
faenilstrange that zypper doesn't have a reverse dependencies checker10:12
faenilI'm sure it uses it for "removing" stuff10:13
faenilSfiet_Konstantin, yeah :D10:13
Sfiet_Konstantinfaenil: it do not10:13
Sfiet_Konstantinnot like apt10:13
Sfiet_Konstantinit leaves useless libs in the system10:13
faenilwell, it needs to know which packages depend on the one you're removing10:14
Sfiet_Konstantinfaenil: yeah, it removes dependencies on the package you are removing10:14
Sfiet_Konstantinbut no "orphans" packages10:14
Sfiet_Konstantinthat have been installed when you insalled something10:14
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faenilno problem though, I just need to get rid of qt4 and all the stuff that uses it10:15
faenilI'll make do with the "remove" list...10:15
w00t__zypper rm libqt4core10:15
faenilw00t__, yeah that's what I meant10:17
faenilw00t__, but since I have to replace all that stuff with qt5 alternatives...I wanted a nice list of stuff depending on qt410:17
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faenilI made a bash script myself just in case, but I was just saying it's strange zypper doesn't have that feature, since it needs it for removing10:18
faenilpackages depending on the one you're removing10:18
sledgesfaenil, remove package, and zypper will suggest removing all the rest. just press N if you want a dry-run10:19
faenilagain, that's what I'm doing :P10:19 would be more useful for zypper to have a command which would return all the packages which it tells you about when removing10:19
faenilnot only when actually removing something :P10:19
sledgesa feature in itself, if more informative things exist, they might spit some graphs again :D10:20
faenilgraph would be ok10:20
faenilI'll just copy and tr :D10:22
sledgeshm here it says IN PROGRESS (under 'aka show dependencies'):
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faenilehehe :10:28
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faenildoes anyone happen to have a list of qt4 -> qt5 packages?10:36
faenillike the list of qt5 alternatives to qt4 middleware10:36
veskuhfaenil, mer-wiki?10:49
faenilveskuh, is that updated? also, it doesn't have qt5 names10:51
veskuhfaenil, -qt5 in case the same package.10:51
veskuhfaenil, not really updated lately, but still I think the only thing that exists10:52
faenilmaybe I should keep using OBS searches then ;:)10:52
faenilveskuh, thanks ;) do you know if there's any new nemo snapshot coming?10:53
veskuhfaenil, don't know.. Sage ^10:53
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xavinuxgreat news! :))12:14
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sledgesfaenil, have you read
faeniljust back from lunch12:35
faenillet's see12:35
* faenil shuts and opens TMO link12:35
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faenilsledges, pretty much known stuff :)12:37
sledgesok then, follow-up here:
* faenil clicks12:38
dm8tbrhmm is the bot not producing html output for this channel?12:39
dm8tbrneed to fix that once I have again access to that box12:40
sledgesdm8tbr, my thoughts 5min ago :D12:41
* dm8tbr patpats Merbot 12:41
faenilalright, I'm updated :)12:43
sledges:) perfetto12:43
faenilactually I think we'll get our "chance" before the phone is out12:43
faenilthat's what I got from the Jolla events I've attended ;912:44
sledgesgood vibes? :)12:44
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faenilsledges, yeah12:47
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faenilsledges, do you know where contextkit is? can't find it on OBS12:56
faenilonly plugins12:56
w00t__mer, and it has no port - the supposed replacement is statefs12:57
faenilw00t__, yeah it's nothing on OBS? :D12:57
faenilw00t__, thanks for saving my time though :P12:58
faenildoesn't Mer use the same OBS for building stuff?12:58
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faenilalright I'll skip contextkit for now and wait for someone to be active on the channel13:01
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sledgesfaenil, no mer has its own13:05
faenilok thanks13:06
sledgesall content then goes into their obs after13:08
faenilyeah I knew about the different git13:08
faenilbut what about the obs13:08
sledgeswhat would you like to see/do in obs what you cannot see in this git tree?13:08
sledgesjust out of curiosity :)13:08
sledgesI don't think I ever had a need to go into the actual mer obs13:09
faenilslaine, understand the world around me :P13:11
slainesigh, again, seriously13:12
faenilnothing was just wondering13:12
faenilit's strange that mer obs is not open :/13:13
sledgesit might be open13:13
sledgessorry slaine for nick similarities :)) it just stems from my initials so :)13:13
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slaineyour just so damn popular and tab completion is damn easy13:14
w00t__the tooling works in different ways due to hysterical raising13:15
sledgesi just got lots of free time on my hands and general verbal diarrhea :D13:15
w00t__in the future it probably will end up all in one OBS, over time13:15
faenilslaine, holy crap I didn't even notice...sorry man :D13:15
faenilw00t__, ok ;)13:16
faenilw00t__, what should I do with contextkit for now?13:18
Stskeepsit should be available from nemor epos13:18
faenilStskeeps, so get rid of it for now?13:19
faenilStskeeps, it IS avaiable, but it depends on Qt413:19
faenil(actually it's only available from Mer repo, but anyway, hope you understood my question :D)13:20
w00t__faenil: let me know once you figure that out, basically13:20
sledgesi bet some important packages depend on contextkit13:20
faenilw00t__, being ironic? :D13:20
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faenilsledges, I bet as well...but since I'm getting rid of qt4 and dependent packages, the problem is very real :D13:21
faenilsledges, basically all qmlapps + lipstick depend on it :D13:23
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faenilStskeeps, about libgif, it seems there's an option to compile it without X11 support, because it seems it's only needed to take gif snapshots of the screen...13:28
faenilor is it already available strapped out of X11?13:28
Stskeeps.. what are you doing?13:30
faenilStskeeps, getting rid of Qt4 and package which depend on it13:30
faenilStskeeps, libgif doesn't depend on Qt4, it was just a question...13:35
faenilsomething I noticed yesterday when tracking x11 dependent pacakges13:35
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faenilw00t__, any advice about packagekit?14:05
faenil(qt4 vs qt5)14:05
w00t__there's an upstream port, upstream is also a lot newer, but it involves API changes14:06
w00t__so someone would need to port packages14:06
faenilw00t__, I I guess I have to leave the qt4 one atm14:07
w00t__Aard: did the new packagekit end up in nemo at all? guess that'd be a first step at fixing that14:07
faenilnemo has
Aardw00t__: no, didn't put it there as the ancient packagemanager in nemo only works with the old qt api14:08
Aardif somebody starts working on a new packagemanager I can put it there14:09
w00t__well if the failures aren't too terrifying then i'm sure faenil can take a crack at fixing it14:09
faenilAard, none uses the package manager on Nemo...I guess it wouldn't be a big waste14:09
faenilw00t__, you mean updating the package manager to use the new Api?14:10
Aardw00t__: I just saw that they changed the api, talked to sage, and we decided not to do it. if I can break it now I can probably find the time tomorrow to move packagekit to gitpkg and update it in nemo14:10
faenilAard, I've never heard anyone using the package manager so far...I'm sure none would complain if it stayed broken for one day :D14:11
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faenilQCA also seems to need porting14:15
rcgfaenil, qca?14:17
rcgyou mean qt crypot architecture?14:17
faenilQt Crypto Arch14:17
rcgit's in mer14:17
rcgincl. qca-ossl14:17
faenilqca-2.0 you mean?14:18
faenilor qca2?14:18
rcgdunno the exact package name anymore14:18
rcgbut it's in mer14:18
faenilrcg, no QCA here
rcgactually, it's in nemo:mw14:20
faenilyeah there's one in nemo14:20
faenilrcg, as you see, that's Qt414:20
faenilI need a Qt5 qca14:20
rcgah, alright, now i see :)14:21
faenilw00t__, Qt5 qca? (sorry for bothering, tell me if you're damn busy won't ping anymore)14:21
rcghaving qca for qt5 would be pretty handy :)14:22
rcgis there actually much of a difference qca-wise?14:22
faenilno idea14:22
w00t__what is it usef for?14:25
rcgw00t__, provides crypto support in a convenient way14:25
w00t__i mean what packages use it atm14:26
rcgmeepasswords, e.g.14:26
rcgdunno about others14:26
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SageAard: I guess you mean tar_git :)14:31
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faenilw00t__, alright, I'll get rid of it :D14:31
AardSage: I don't care how it's called :p14:32
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faenildoes anyone know current status of "tracker" qt5 port?14:35
faenilit's in "currently being ported" on the wiki14:35
faenilbut I can't find any proof :D14:35
faeniloh sorry misread, NOT currently being ported the wiki sayd :D14:36
faenilfinished scanning qt4 packages :P14:40
faeniltime to write a wiki and ask help :D14:40
Aardfaenil: for tracker we just finished moving commhistory to sqlite storage -> we should now finally be able to drop all the maemo-specific crap, and if after that everything still works look into qt5 port14:44 you keep tracker at the moment14:44
faenilI've seen commhistory changes14:45
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Aardtumbler would probably currently be the next important one14:45
Aardjust noticed that quill is ported, so that sohuld be easy14:46
faenilStskeeps, it seems there's a lot of Qt4 stuff still...should I leave Qt4 and relevant non-ported packages?14:48
faenilAard, I see, thanks :)14:48
faenilAard, I'm trying to make this Qt4 free + Wayland i486 image...14:48
Aardfaenil: iirc there should be mostly 3 areas left: tracker, tumbler, and contextkit-plugins loaded via stetefs14:49
faenilyeah, agree...those are the biggest obstacles I found...14:50
faenilactually didn't find anything about tumbler14:50
faenilis it part of nemo?14:50
faenilit's in the repo but it's not installed by default in nemo14:50
Aardit's currently only required by the mtp-stack, which iirc is not installed per default in nemo images14:52
sledgessomeone once suggested me to move away from using tumbler and use nemo-qml-plugins instead14:52
sledgesif i need to generate a thumbnail14:52
Aardthere are situations (like mtp) where you need to be able to do thumbnails in the c++ part of your code. nemo-qml-plugins does not provide that14:53
faenilAard, actually it does, at least that's what we use in qmlgallery14:57
w00t___from C++_14:57
faenilright, that's only exposed to QML...14:57
w00t__yeah :p14:58
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Aardw00t__: when did that happen? last time you told me that it can't be done :p15:00
faenilAard, you can ask for thumbnails from QML, not from C++ :)15:01
Aardah, so my statement was true :)15:01
faenilyeah :P15:01
Aarddon't confuse me :)15:02
faenilahahah sorry :)15:02
faenilhow can I create a page in Nemo wiki?15:02
w00t__it is possible, but hasn't been done yet15:02
w00t__faenil: log in to the wiki and create one15:02
faenilw00t__, eh.... :P15:02
w00t__I don't follow :P15:02
faenilguess what, I've been looking for 5 minutes for freaking CREATE NEW button XD15:03
faenilI've always modified, never created one from scratch, and there's no "new" button here, or something like that :/15:03
faenilw00t__, am I blind, or do I need special permissions or something?15:05
faenilw00t__, so you just create a page by visiting a random Url? :D15:05
faenilif anyone has 2 minutes time, I'd appreciate any input on that, thanks!15:08
Sfiet_Konstantinfaenil: I guess that tracker stays as tracker15:13
Sfiet_Konstantinit do not depends on Qt15:13
faenilSfiet_Konstantin, yes it does, it depends on QtGui15:14
faenilthe packages on that page all depend on Qt415:14
faenilSfiet_Konstantin, don't ask me why, I trust LDD and zypper :D15:14
Sfiet_Konstantinisn't tracker supposed to be
Sfiet_Konstantina _gnome_ project thing ?15:14
Sfiet_Konstantinand we know that gnome _hates_ qt related things15:15
faeniloh it also depends on QtCore15:15
Aardjust ignore tracker until we dropped the maemo-bits15:17
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faenilAard, alright I'll leave Qt4 and tracker in then15:18
faenilAard, what about contextkit/statefs?15:18
Aardfaenil: stays for now, we'll slowly replace the contextkit providers by native statefs plugins. new software should use statefs (and can subscribe to whatever contextkit plugins provide through statefs as well)15:19
Aardso aim in first step should be an image where the only qt4-bits are related to contextkit providers15:20
faeniland tracker15:20
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faenilAard, could you give a look at the page and fix/complete the missing points? should only take 2-3minutes <315:22
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faenilAard, I'll take that as a no, lol XD15:50
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sledgeswhat are the chances with wayland and n900 btw ?..16:09
faenilouch :D16:09
xavinuxfaemil: how I can help you?16:11
faenilxavinux, hey :)16:11
faenilsee if you know the answers to the ??? I put on the wiki page ,)16:12
faenilor, if you know something about Nemo's boot process, teach me :)16:15
xavinuxwill se them...16:16
xavinuxto start taking a look at systemd
faenilalright thanks16:21
dm8tbrsledges: well in theory there is a working android driver for that silicon revision16:21
* dm8tbr knows because he used it in the openAOS project16:22
Venemo_N9in theory16:22
faenilVenemo_N9, I can't believe that now that we both have spare time, you don't have a pc ...crap :P16:23
dm8tbrwell, the driver is known working. It would need someone to sit down and make it work16:23
Venemo_N9faenil, Yeah, crap...16:24
Venemo_N9faenil, btw, are you coming to SmartDevCon?16:24
faenilVenemo_N9, long story short, no, most likely16:25
Venemo_N9aww :(16:25
Venemo_N9what's the excuse?16:25
faenilgot more of them, but I think this is no place for them ;)16:27
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MSameerfaenil: great work on
faenilMSameer, thanks man :)16:32
MSameerfaenil: however, I feel that email should have been sent to nemo/mer mailing lists too16:32
sledgesit has ;)16:32
MSameerhas it?16:32
MSameerI missed it then16:32
sledgeswell done faenil :)16:32
* MSameer blushes16:32
MSameeroh yeah found it16:32
* MSameer slaps himself16:32
* sledges takes the large trout back16:33
faenilMSameer, sledges forced me to16:33
MSameersledges: don't take it. I can grill it for food :D16:33
sledgeslol, I'm proud of that, faenil just revealed his talent of pushing through important information in an informal way - a powerful marketing weapon :)16:33
MSameerfaenil: well, I guess the main blocker is the black screen with vkb16:34
faenilsledges, oh did I? XD cool16:34
MSameeri tried to see what can be done and miserably failed16:34
* MSameer tickles faenil 16:34
faenilMSameer, I don't even know what you're talking about, I've never used the VM before this moment :D16:35
faenilI heard that there were many black screen issues though16:35
MSameerfaenil: I am just jumping to N9 images but maybe I should not16:35
sledgesjust avoid testing vkb while still on vm images16:35
MSameerre tracker: what qt5 port do we need?16:36
faenilisn't there the chance that it will work once we're done with the wayland image?16:36
MSameerI can help with that I guess. I am not a tracker guy but I did a few patches16:36
MSameerfaenil: no :P16:36
faenilMSameer, oww :(16:36
* faenil is now a sad panda16:36
MSameerfaenil: maybe w00t__ can shed some light on the vkb/black screen issues16:37
faenilI don't know what happened to those guys, they've been quite quiet since I've been back (which is 2 days)16:37
faenilI think Stskeeps really handcuffed them to the desks16:38
MSameerfaenil: you said it, busy with sailfish :|16:38
faenilyeah I know...sad for nemo community, but true16:38
faenilI don't know whom to ask questions when I need help :D16:39
MerbotNemo bug 347 in x86-generic "Screen is black when VKB is open in VirtualBox" [Critical,New]16:39
sledgesworthy comments by Carsten16:39
MSameerfaenil: it's not that sad because most of the qt5 done for sailfish is also for nemo16:40
MSameerbut let's not get into that ;)16:41
MSameeri will go grill sledges' trout for food :D16:41
faenilMSameer, yeah sure16:42
* sledges ' pet trout.... :'(16:42
sledgesanyway, still got another 199 in the pond16:42
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cybettemmm trout16:51
cybettefaenil: great call-to-action email :)16:51
faenilcybette, o/16:51
faenilthanks :)16:51
faenilI suck at writing, but this had to be done16:52
sledgesyou don't suck at underestimating yourself :))16:52
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cybettefaenil: you did great. reading it, i am so eager to join (except i don't have enough experience in nemo)16:54
cybetteso all i could do for now is help you retweet :P16:54
faenilcybette, oh cool, thanks for the feedback :D16:54
faenilcybette, not even the time I guess :P16:54
faenillooking at all the jollaians in here :D16:54
cybetteyeah time is another factor16:55
faenilsledges, :)16:57
cybettepersonally i hoped to have at least one app ready when the phone starts to ship but so many other "higher priority" things screaming at me16:58
cybettemaybe i'll go for something straightforward like a fart app16:58
sledgescybette :D16:58
fk_lxcybette: not only you lack of time17:00
faenilcybette, ahaha17:01
faenilxavinux, read the guide17:02
faenilbut I still don't have a clue about how that fits into Nemo :)17:02
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sledgesbunch of .services files get launched in parallel where possible17:10
faenilsledges, great summary, is there a place where I can look for those files?17:11
faenilhow are they handled?17:11
sledgesone seed file, all starts from there17:11
sledgesthe .target files are a bit blurry to me though, but they also play big part in the boot process17:12
sledgesafterwards when user-session@100000.service is launched, it executes further .service files from /usr/lib/systemd/user/17:12
faenilsledges, only a few .wants files in there17:12
sledgesI have 166 files in there, most of them .service, .wants files are directories btw17:15
sledgesthat quite old nemo though17:15
sledgesrecently we had an overhaul, but I expect lots of files to be there still17:15
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sledgesdo a `find / -name "*.service" -type f` to see where they're at17:16
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faenillet's watch
sledgeslol nice17:19
* sledges home time; cyas!17:19
faenilsledges, I was looking at /etc/systemd ;)17:19
sledgeseh! :))17:20
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MSameerfaenil: so the question is: How can one help?17:27
faenilMSameer, I think I wrote something in the email :)17:27
faenilwe have to replace x11 compositor and qt4 services with qt5 and qml wayland compositor (which is in lipstick-qt5)17:28
MSameerfaenil: there is a compositor already for wayland17:29
faeniland get rid of qt4 depdendent packages and replace them with their qt5 ports17:29
faenilMSameer, in fact I said it's in lipstick-qt5 :D17:29
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MSameerso what is the problem then ?17:30
faenilmake it :)17:30
faenilI spent the day researching qt4 dependent packages and looking for their ports/alternatives17:30
faenilnow first I need to see if replacing those packages the image gets actually built17:30
MSameeri am not a hardcore nemo/mer contributor. I just do fixes every now and then17:30
faeniland second, I don't know almost anything about systemd17:30
faenilMSameer, I've been away since January, I only contribute like 2 weeks every 4-5 months17:31
faenilbecause of university17:31
faenilso we're on the same boat :)17:31
faenilbut we really don't have to do much, it's just about having people who know how to do it17:31
MSameerso one needs to get the i486 image and start replacing stuff17:31
faenilI don't know systemd (I'm watching this to try fix that so I don't know how I can replace the x11 compositor with qmlcompositor at boot17:32
faeniland all the other qt4 services17:32
MSameerthat is not that hard17:32
faenilit's not, it just needs someone who knows how the boot proces works in current Nemo :)17:33
faeniltold you, it's all simple stuff, but needs specific knowledge17:33
MSameermy issue is all phones I connect to my laptop insist on using the same ip
MSameerso I can only connect 1 phone at a time :(17:33
faenilNemo doesn't have it's actually you giving them the same IP :D17:33
faeniljust change that :P17:33
faenilanyway, I don't see how that relates to our matter ^^17:34
MSameerlet me see17:34
* MSameer boots his nemo N917:34
MSameerit's for me as now I have m harmattan phone and too lazy to replace it :p17:34
MSameerbah, I will17:35
faenilyou don't need a phone for this thing17:35
faenilit's all on VM :)17:35
MSameerfaenil: xorg-launch-helper-3-1.1.6.armv7hl17:36
MSameerfaenil: that installs xorg.service in /usr/lib/systemd/user17:36
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faenilok, that's one thing17:37
MSameerExecStart=/usr/bin/xorg-launch-helper $OPTIONS17:37
MSameerso we kill tha package and bring on another package17:37
faenilare you sure that's enough?17:37
MSameerthat "other" package should launch wayland17:37
MSameerfaenil: of course I am not sure :D17:38
faenilI know that when you stop user-session@100000.service it kills X, for example17:38
MSameerbut who is sure about everything? :p17:38
MSameerfaenil: yes because that is a user service17:38
MSameeror i think so17:38
faenilI'm trying to get a bigger picture of how the boot process works17:40
faenilso that I can act afterwards17:40
faenilalso how do we track and replace the .service files for qt4 services?17:44
faenilread through all the service files?17:44
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faenilwhat about the .wants, .targets files?17:44
MSameerfaenil: my understanding is /lib/systemd/system/ dictates the default systemd target17:46
faenilwhat is a systemd target, first of all17:46
MSameer/lib/systemd/system/ -> graphical.target17:46
MSameernot sure how to explain that17:46
faenileh :) that's my problem, I'm trying to fix that first17:47
MSameera target is a "state" systemd should reach ?17:47
faenilI need to understand systemd basis first17:47
faeniloh ok17:47
MSameerfaenil: are you familiar with linux runlevels?17:47
MSameerI would say it's a runlevel for the sake of simplicity17:47
Morpog_PCAkademy videos are uploaded! Mer SailfishOS,_Open_Source_and_Sailfish_OS.webm All videos
faenilMorpog_PC, great!17:48
Morpog_PClistening to lbt at the moment :)17:48
faenilMSameer, there are also runlevels though17:49
faenildinner, bbl17:50
MSameerfaenil: it's also dependency based boot17:51
MSameerfaenil: so it wants to reach the default target which is /lib/systemd/system/default.target17:52
MSameerfaenil: it's a symlink to in our case so it checks what this target wants in
MSameerthat is my understanding based on poking around for a few minutes17:53
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piggzinstallation on nemo on n950, 95% complete18:09
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piggzim not getting an ip address from nemo ... ive got the usb0 device, but hung waiting for an ip address18:31
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piggzaw rats, looks like i broke nemo already, doesnt boot after a zypper dup18:54
w00t__piggz: check journalctl18:55
piggzw00t__: how? all vie got is a nemo boot screen18:56
w00t__usb should still be functioning at that point i think (phdeswer?)18:57
Sfiet_Konstantinpiggz: don't you have usb netwroking ?18:57
piggzoh, lets see18:57
piggzno, idont appear to have usb networking18:57
piggzi appear to have a usb disk tho18:58
phdeswerWell the usb network is not dhcp, you have to set it up manually. So if you have usb0 it is there.18:59
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piggzphdeswer: i have set up manual networking, but i dont have a usb0 device18:59
phdeswerpiggz: ah ok. Anything in your dmesg?18:59
faenilMSameer, back :)19:00
faenilpiggz, evening ;)19:00
faenilI guess you're installing nemo :D19:00
phdeswerBut well if you have an usb disk you might have the device in mass-storage mode.19:01
piggzfaenil: i had it installed, then i broke it ;)19:02
faenilpiggz, eheh :)19:03
piggzphdeswer: i can probably get networking at the moslo prompt19:03
piggzwell, i can just export the filesystem and extract the image again19:04
piggzw00t__: phdeswer: i have the filesystem on my laptop..what logs should i look at (if any)19:06
phdeswerw00t__: btw do you know which version of usb_moded is in the nemo repos? As the last version has a slightly different way to configure modes, and unless sage fixed the image generation19:06
phdeswerpiggz: could you check the  /etc/usb-moded dir?19:06
piggzphdeswer: ask19:07
phdeswerpiggz: so you should get a dialog on the UI asking which mode you want.19:07
piggzphdeswer: yes, that was all failed after rebooting after a zypper dup19:07
piggzon boot it just stuck at the nemo boot screen19:07
phdeswerAh ok. Well change that ask into developer_mode.19:08
phdeswerSo if the device boots far enough you might have usb networking.19:08
piggzi noticed that the zypper dup installed wayland btw19:09
phdeswerpiggz: so if the UI does not come up, there is no way to tell the usb profile handler which profile to select and thus no usb connection. So if you tell it now to go to usb networking mode by default it might come up19:10
faenilMSameer, ok thanks ;) let me know when you're back to work on it ;)19:11
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piggzphdeswer: w00t__: ok, networking with no gui now works19:13
piggzim logged in as nemo19:13
piggzlooks like X didnt load19:13
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w00t__and journalctl?19:14
w00t__zypper search mesa19:18
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w00t__there's your problem19:20
w00t__ssu lr19:20
piggzw00t__: i havnt used ssu yet to enable/disable repositories (just reading the wiki on it)19:22
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w00t__the default image already comes preconfigured19:22
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w00t__ok good19:24
w00t__zypper search -t pattern19:24
piggzinstall mer-graphics-common?19:25
w00t__show me the list first19:25
piggzum == bad? :)19:26
w00t__Sage: aren't there supposed to be a set of device adaptation patterns19:26
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w00t__this is an n950, right?19:27
w00t__(or n9)19:27
w00t__piggz: ^19:28
piggzw00t__: n95019:28
Sagephdeswer: we are still using older version of usb-moded in nemo19:28
Sagephdeswer: the usb-moded-old branch19:28
w00t__piggz: <- zypper in all of that, it'll complain about conflicts with mesa stuff, pastebin the messages when it comes up19:29
Sagew00t__: yes you found them already :)19:29
w00t__Sage: I did19:29
w00t__but why does his device not list it19:29
w00t__adaptation repos are there19:29
Sagessu s output somewhere?19:30
w00t__and also why do we keep getting so many people installing llvmpipe19:30
w00t__it makes me think our default config is broken or something19:30
Sagew00t__: I'm guessing wayland stuff is bringing that in somehow19:30
Sagew00t__: some wayland so dep that isn't fullfilled in sgx driver19:31
w00t__it should be all ok..19:31
w00t__and I've seen people hit this before the ti-omap3-sgx patching19:31
Sageyes, then it definitely was a problem with wayland19:31
Sagepatterns seem to be in order there19:32
* w00t__ idly ponders if we should make the n950 kernel conflict with llvmpipe :P19:35
w00t__maybe if people see the kernel being removed they'd get warning signs19:35
piggzw00t__: there was nothing to do...
w00t__zypper repos19:37
piggzmer-core and nemo-platform19:38
w00t__ok, so somehow, you've got adaptation repos in ssu but not in zypper?19:39
w00t__ssu ur19:39
w00t__zypper repos19:40
piggzw00t__: ok, now have adaption0 and 119:40
w00t__try those installs again19:40
piggzok ... how do i bring up wifi network with no ui? :)19:41
w00t__with difficulty19:42
w00t__you may be able to persuade it to route over usb somehow, I'm not sure how19:42
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w00t__Sage: perhaps this is what happened to others? ^19:49
faenilw00t__, there are updated USB networking instructions19:50
faenildebian/ubuntu only though, iirc19:50
* w00t__ hugs OS X :-p19:52
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piggzfaenil: thx, i used those to get forwarding to the device can ping, but no dns (resolv.conf sets nameserver
piggzfaenil: my bad, it works better at the top!19:59
piggzw00t__: what did you want to see again?  i resolved the conflicts by removing mesa-llvmpipe-libEGL-9.0.3-1.1.8.armv7hl20:01
piggzhowever, X isnt loading (i can see it trying to)20:03
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piggzwhy doenst G jump to the end of file in journalctl!20:11
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w00t__journalctl -f will give you a live view20:23
w00t__that doesn't look nice20:23
w00t__piggz: try rebooting?20:23
piggzw00t__: think its working, got some funky colours like first time20:25
faenilpiggz, that's Nemo's unique feature ;)20:25
piggzfaenil: w00t__:; maybe i spoke too early, its just black now :) looks like i dont have libEGL20:29
piggzusr/bin/mcompositor: error while loading shared libraries:
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piggzwhat package is that in?20:29
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faenilpiggz, on VM it's provided by20:30
faenilnot sure on phone :/20:30
w00t__piggz: zypper search ti-omap3-sgx20:31
piggzah, thats the one i removed to allow the installation of the other packages :)20:31
w00t__you do not want llvmpipe20:31
faenilpiggz, no no, no llvmpipe for you :P20:31
faenilpiggz, my example is because I'm on VM,  and it uses llvmpipe20:31
w00t__piggz: rpm -q ti-omap3-sgx20:32
w00t__and rpm -ql ti-omap3-sgx20:32
piggz[root@localhost nemo]# rpm -q ti-omap3-sgx20:32
faeniloh right, ti-omap20:32
w00t__piggz: ls -al /usr/lib/libEGL*20:33
Aardfaenil: signon-glib is required by the telepathy accounts bridge20:34
Aard(about the wiki page)20:34
piggz[root@localhost nemo]# ls -al /usr/lib/libEGL*20:34
faenilAard, alright thanks ;)20:34
piggz-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 6092 2013-06-19 09:58 /usr/lib/libEGL_r125.so20:34
piggzlrwxrwxrwx 1 root root   14 1970-01-01 02:00 /usr/lib/ -> libEGL_r125.so20:34
faenilAard, I don't really understand what to replace "signon" package with20:34
faenil(apart from the other ???)20:35
w00t__piggz: maybe you should go to devel level, as there were some fixes related to this there20:35
Aardfaenil: signon should be coming from mer, not be in nemo:mw20:35
w00t__piggz: ssu s says what?20:35
faenilAard, yeah but I didn't find any "signon-qt5" package20:37
faenilonly libsignon-qt5, which should be something different20:37
w00t__ssu re latest, ssu fl devel, ssu ur, zypper ref -f, zypper dup should get you a device running the latest and hopefully greatest20:38
piggzsounds good!20:38
Aardfaenil: signon is iirc just the daemon-stuff, which already should be qt5 nowadays20:41
faenilis libsignon and signon the same thing?20:41
faenilthat link got me confused20:41
piggzw00t__: i shose solution 1 to resolve the fact nothing provides
w00t__piggz: what solutions? I don't see anything20:42
Aardfaenil: yes, it's the same source package20:42
faenilAard, signon looks Qt4 from there20:43
w00t__looks like something that requires fixing, i'll try take a look in a bit or tomorrow (or Aard, do you know what that's about?)20:46
Aardw00t__: I didn't spot qt4 signon on my device last time I checked20:47
w00t__Aard: I mean the buteo thing from piggz20:48
piggzso, whats the easiest way to create app packages for nemo? (preferably completely integrated into qtcreator ;)20:48
Aardw00t__: my guess is that the mer:qt repo is not included there, the renaming from qt0systeminfo to qt5systeminfo was pretty recently20:49
piggzare the qml api's close to harmattan?20:49
w00t__it should be20:49
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faeniltomorrow, cya guys ;)20:57
faenilAard, I'll talk to you tomorrow :)20:57
faenil(if you have time :D)20:57
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Sagew00t__: maybe, however if the packages are installed it is more or less user error if users says yes when it suggests to install mesa and remove sgx driver21:10
piggzw00t__: that seems to boot faster!21:15
w00t__hopefully it boots into something that works21:16
w00t__oh, it does?21:16
* w00t__ tries to not look surprised21:17
piggzso, first things first, i should make space-invaders work on it!21:18
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mhall119hey guys, who works on the folderlistmodel QML plugin?21:56
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